Speaker A
Like they have this metal key that actually sticks into the car and turns, which they got rid of in the 911. They have a lot of things like. So wait, so it's a key?
WVFRM hosts discuss Samsung/Android notification bugs, the Surface Duo-style iPhone Duo review and app optimization, plus the Tesla Roadster and Porsche Mission X car events.
Key Takeaways
- Phantom and stale notification badges remain a widespread software annoyance across Samsung, Slack, and Gmail.
- The foldable iPhone Duo's usefulness depends heavily on developers optimizing their apps for the larger screen.
- Early adopters should expect uneven app support and some camera limitations on new foldable hardware.
- Tesla's and Porsche's new car announcements generate hype, but the hosts remain skeptical until products ship.
What the video covers
- The episode opens with a discussion of the Tesla Roadster event and Porsche's Mission X car event, both held in the same week.
- Hosts complain about persistent phantom notification badges, such as a voicemail notification on a Samsung phone that never clears and Gmail showing thousands of unread emails.
- Slack's unread badges are criticized for showing notifications that the user believes were already read.
- The hosts review the foldable iPhone Duo after about a week and a half of use, noting that many third-party apps are not yet optimized for its wide inner screen.
- Unoptimized apps appear with a black bar down the side or a letterboxed layout, while some apps like Safari and Google Calendar adapt better.
- The hosts discuss the phone's cameras, noting that the ultrawide photos are noisy and soft outside the center of the frame.
- Concerns are raised about the device's high price (around $2,000) and the risk of dropping it, with some mention of protective booklet cases.
- The Roadster discussion covers Tesla's marketing claims, the car's aerodynamic wing and race-mode gating, and skepticism about the company's promises.
- The Porsche segment highlights the car's design, its key fob and digital features, and how it sits above the 911 in the lineup.
- The episode closes with a sponsor read for Framer and light commentary on tech industry hype versus delivery.
Full Transcript — Download SRT & Markdown
Speaker A
Well, it's not like shaped like a key. It's the key fob. The key is described a regular I realize what I'm doing. I realize what I'm doing.
Speaker A
Well, it's not like shaped like a key. It's the key fob. The key is described a regular. I realize what I'm doing. I realize what I'm doing.
Speaker A
I'm Andrew. I'm David. over at the producer table today. Ellis and Mariah holding it down.
Speaker A
[Music] Yo, what is up, people of the internet? Welcome back to another episode of the Waveform Podcast. We're your hosts. I'm Marquez.
Speaker A
I appreciate it. A doozy today. Mainly cuz there's two gigantic things that happened in the last week. Right. Right after That's funny. Right after we shot last week's podcast was a massive car event. Obviously the Porsche Mission S
Speaker A
I'm Andrew. I'm David. Over at the producer table today, Ellis and Mariah are holding it down.
Speaker A
The Tesla Roadster and there was uh uh the embargo for Surface Duo reviews is up. So, we have been using Surface. I said Surface Duo.
Speaker A
And we got a doozy. A duo. I tried. I can't believe I typed it. You read it.
Speaker A
We've been using it. David, you have yours. It's the blue one. The blue one.
Speaker A
I appreciate it. A doozy today, mainly because there are two gigantic things that happened in the last week. Right. Right after. That's funny. Right after we shot last week's podcast, there was a massive car event. Obviously, the Porsche Mission S
Speaker A
it's been like to use them and daily these things. But first, did they even test this?
Speaker A
event. Oh, and sorry. Also, I think wasn't there another one? Hey. Oh yeah, the Tesla Roadster camera event.
Speaker A
We've been getting bugs fixed for weeks now. This is great. That's right. I don't know what I did and good start.
Speaker A
The Tesla Roadster, and there was the embargo for Surface Duo reviews, which is up. So we have been using Surface. I said Surface Duo.
Speaker A
And what that means is that I got one voicemail 3 weeks ago and that means I got a notification. I have a voicemail.
Speaker A
I thought you were making another joke. I should have leaned into it. I should have [laughter] leaned into it. My brain is. Anyway, iPhone Duo reviews are out.
Speaker A
I've had this I've had this exact issue and it is a Samsung issue. The voicemail notification never goes away. I now I'm trying to remember how I got rid of it because I think there was something about I think you have to install like
Speaker A
We've been using it. David, you have yours. It's the blue one. The blue one.
Speaker A
See, that would make sense. See, I didn't do anything and then this morning my phone said, "Oh, it's time to update and you don't have to be in the beta anymore." And I'm like, "That's what I want." And we're so back.
Speaker A
White one. The colors are. Here's mine. I forgot the names of the colors. They're like light sky and star white, dark sky, basically. Yeah, and we have our thoughts. The reviews are out, and we can talk all about what
Speaker A
I think no one cares. Notifications that don't go away might be one of the most annoying bugs in any software.
Speaker A
it's been like to use them daily. But first, did they even test this?
Speaker A
That's another thing. That's a Slack thing all the time. the Slack uh like not the Slack app will have a little badge next to it with notifications and I'll go, "Oh, I thought I read all of them." And then I'll open it and Slack
Speaker A
Mariah has one. She said potentially. I have a minor complaint, if anyone has. That's what this is for. This whole thing is minor complaints.
Speaker A
That's a recent issue. I feel like Slack Slack's been doing that for a long time.
Speaker A
We've been getting bugs fixed for weeks now. This is great. That's right. I don't know what I did, and good start.
Speaker A
it. You got to click on it. No. Gmail definitely has this issue, too, cuz it says that I have 9,317 unread emails.
Speaker A
So I don't know if I enabled developer settings or something on my Samsung, and it involuntarily enrolled me in the new beta software for One UI.
Speaker A
Yeah, it's all [clears throat] spam. Yeah, it's all spam. Well, I'm sorry, Mariah. I hope Samsung hears this and fixes it imminently.
Speaker A
What that means is I got one voicemail three weeks ago, and that means I got a notification. I have a voicemail.
Speaker A
Oh, they changed it. They changed it and not only did they change it, but actively someone messaged me and said, "Hey, I brought this to the attention of people and they said, but they were already working on it." So,
Speaker A
Every time I dismiss it, it comes back within five minutes. So I have a perpetual notification that I have a voicemail when I do not.
Speaker A
Android Auto. Yeah, Android Auto. I feel I think we need the um there's the killed by Google website, right?
Speaker A
I've had this exact issue, and it is a Samsung issue. The voicemail notification never goes away. I'm trying to remember how I got rid of it, because I think there was something about installing the visual voicemail app and then reading it in that app, and then it goes away or something.
Speaker A
Well, hey, speaking of speaking of did they even test this? Uh, what has it been like to live with the iPhone Duo the past week and a half?
Speaker A
See, that would make sense. I didn't do anything, and then this morning my phone said, "Oh, it's time to update, and you don't have to be in the beta anymore." And I'm like, "That's what I want." And we're so back.
Speaker A
the Duo, but I think most of them like to have a physical device and would like to spend extra time with it to make sure their apps are perfect. So, the past week and a half of using it, and I think
Speaker A
No, I've definitely had that issue, and the fact that it's still an issue suggests that either no one's tested it or no one cares.
Speaker A
No, they are unoptimized apps. Yeah. And that just basically means there's like a bar down the side and they look a little weird and kind of ugly and they're not optimized to use the space at all.
Speaker A
I think no one cares. Notifications that don't go away might be one of the most annoying bugs in any software.
Speaker A
Yeah. So, as of right now, there's like three apps on. The weird thing is that there are three states of optimization for Duo. There's like not updated to iOS 27 at all. Yeah.
Speaker A
Definitely. It happens in Slack all the time, where there's just the dot on my doc on my computer, or it will say somewhere in the sidebar, in the icons, that there's something, and I'll click everything.
Speaker A
Just 27 has like partial Duo support and 27.1 has like full DA support. I barely consider it duo support. I just consider it like kind of stretching it to be bigger.
Speaker A
That's another thing. That's a Slack thing all the time. The Slack app will have a little badge next to it with notifications, and I'll go, "Oh, I thought I read all of them." And then I'll open it, and Slack
Speaker A
Yeah. It somehow feels worse. Did have do you use Google? I do use Google calendar.
Speaker A
will be like, "You don't have anything." And then I'll close it, and it's gone.
Speaker A
you open it and it stays the exact same size. Yeah. And then we were like, "Oh, rotate it.
Speaker A
That's a recent issue. I feel like Slack has been doing that for a long time.
Speaker A
There is that expand button. There's also the rotate button. Yeah. Which makes it wide.
Speaker A
Maybe my phone just [laughter] started doing that. Slack will be like, "Yo, you have an unread mention." And I'll go, and it's something I've actively replied to multiple times. Like, "How is this unread?" Well, you replied, you didn't click on
Speaker A
are like fully unoptimized, like Google apps or RIP Arc Search, my favorite mobile browser, which they will not update sad because Arc is dead, so I need to find a new browser.
Speaker A
it. You have to click on it. No. Gmail definitely has this issue, too, because it says I have 9,317 unread emails.
Speaker A
It's like the exact same width as the iPhone 18 Pro. And this makes sense because developers have already coded for that. But then you just get this giant black bar on the right and it looks pretty rough.
Speaker A
Yeah, you only have 9,315. I recently emailed you 9,300 times. So that's actually going to check out perfectly.
Speaker A
Yeah. Or just move the controls to that side. Exactly. It's tough with Google Calendar, too, cuz you have that plus button right It's right there next to the black bar and it's covering things and it's like if this was moved over 40 pixels, it would
Speaker A
Yeah, it's all [clears throat] spam. Yeah, it's all spam. Well, I'm sorry, Mariah. I hope Samsung hears this and fixes it imminently.
Speaker A
right side of the screen. And I'm still, this is probably just muscle memory, but I'm still hitting the bottom left because that's where Pocketcast always used to be for me. And then I open Telegram by accident.
Speaker A
They won't. They won't. Maybe. Maybe. We did get one fixed the other day. I actually got the megaphone issue we had with the dropdown that showed every single post by minute.
Speaker A
Yeah. So, the big philosophical idea with Duo, I guess, if you haven't seen the reviews, is basically it moves all the controls from the bottom over to the side. Moves all the controls from the top also over to the side. And that
Speaker A
Oh, they changed it. They changed it, and not only did they change it, but someone messaged me and said, "Hey, I brought this to the attention of people, and they said they were already working on it." So
Speaker A
Yeah. Yeah. Can I ask a question? Yeah. Yeah. Um, we're complaining about it being not optimized specifically on this, but for other foldables, I assume this is a typical thing that always happens at launch or is this not true? sort of, but
Speaker A
we're taking credit. We're taking credit. Was there the Google Maps thing where it started showing the speed before you would even leave? You got that changed.
Speaker A
optimized, but that Google calendar on the interior screen of that is like bad bad.
Speaker A
Android Auto. Yeah, Android Auto. I think we need the, there's the "Killed by Google" website, right?
Speaker A
many different size Android phones in the first place. So iPhones have just been the same aspect ratio year after year after year. And iPhone apps are easier to develop because all iPhones look the same. And so on Android phones
Speaker A
"Fixed by Waveform." We need "Fixed by Waveform." [laughter] That's a good call. That's a good call.
Speaker A
I keep saying surface. On the iPhone Duo, it just looks like a normal iPhone app on the side and then a black bar, which is a little bit more jarring, but and it's a little more obvious when it's
Speaker A
Well, hey, speaking of did they even test this? What has it been like to live with the iPhone Duo the past week and a half?
Speaker A
Yeah. And so my like line near the end of the review was like, if you're still thinking about buying one and you're like trying to decide, if you do buy it now, you won't get it for another two
Speaker A
I have so many thoughts. There are so many big stories with it. One of the biggest is the app story, which is that most developers don't have an iPhone Duo, and they have had the ability to develop for
Speaker A
Hopefully. Hopefully. Yeah. Google has so many teams on so many of their apps that it's going to I don't even know if half the apps are going to be optimized. The And the benefit of this versus like when
Speaker A
the Duo, but I think most of them like to have a physical device and want to spend extra time with it to make sure their apps are perfect. So the past week and a half of using it, and I think
Speaker A
as long as they keep the same display size as long as they keep the same display size which I think they will. I don't think they're going to change that where like before it was wild west. We have
Speaker A
for probably the first two or three weeks of people getting them, unboxing them, and moving into them, you will find that most apps have not been tested with it. Did they even test this?
Speaker A
and hyper optimize Android for flexible screen sizes because they just knew like there are too many types of Android phones. You can't hard code for every single possible screen size.
Speaker A
No, they are unoptimized apps. Yeah. That basically means there's a bar down the side, and they look a little weird and kind of ugly, and they're not optimized to use the space at all.
Speaker A
And I think that that has to do with the fact that one it's very short and squat.
Speaker A
But when they do get optimized, they look so good. Every time I see new app updates available and I get another app that checks the box for Duo support, I get so happy.
Speaker A
And the friction of needing to open your phone and then do the thing and then physically shutting it when you're done.
Speaker A
Yeah. So as of right now, there are about three apps on. The weird thing is that there are three states of optimization for Duo. There's not updated to iOS 27 at all. Yeah.
Speaker A
It's funny because I'm pretty sure the way they want this to be marketed is you saying like it's really bad at doing all those things. Like this is supposed to be like multitasking, big screen, lots of different things to do, like use your
Speaker A
There's the updated Google apps. Yeah. A lot of Google apps. There's updated to iOS 27, and then there's 27.1.
Speaker A
Is what it is for me for you. But I don't think that's how they would want to market this thing. I think they would want this thing to be like, "This does everything you could ever want to do. Be distracted beyond
Speaker A
Just 27 has partial Duo support, and 27.1 has full Duo support. I barely consider it Duo support. I just consider it kind of stretching it to be bigger.
Speaker A
No, I like it. I think it's stupid. It's like that's like an iPad type thing. Like the folio cases for the iPad, they do the same thing. It's like it's closed. And when I really want to be intentional about opening it, then I
Speaker A
Yeah. Or putting more of the background in the area. The Google Calendar interior screen one was the craziest thing I've ever seen.
Speaker A
could do like a FaceTime or watch a video like that, but it's really not good for Wait, I pushed it way further back. I mean, you can do that, but it's still unstable. Oh, you mean like vertical?
Speaker A
Yeah. It somehow feels worse. Do you use Google Calendar?
Speaker A
Yeah. I had a similar thought with reviewing the the hamburger style flips. Flips with like the Zfold Z Flip, for example. Yeah. You can't really accidentally just open your phone and start doomcrolling Tik Tok.
Speaker A
I do use Google Calendar. Did you look at it on the interior screen? I have. I'm trying to think of what I mean. Yeah. [clears throat] Besides that. So, we were doing it at the lunch table the other day. You open it, and it stays the exact same size. Yeah. And then we were like, "Oh, rotate it.
Speaker A
just notification triaging and just like making sure I see text and then like closing it and I'm not going to doom scroll. But if I like open the phone and decide to go use it, then I'm going to
Speaker A
It'll fit better." And the first time you rotate it, it actually gets smaller somehow because it's a vertical thing.
Speaker A
still do it, but there's a little bit of that. Everything is much smaller and it's just like not really a great you see less information, especially when it's not optimized. It's like a much worse experience on the outside. So, you can
Speaker A
There is that expand button. There's also the rotate button. Yeah, which makes it wide.
Speaker A
people's doom scrolling abilities that they won't use the front screen. I really do think a lot of doom scrolling just comes from like the muscle memory of unlocking unlocking your phone just like rapidly though, you know, without even thinking about it,
Speaker A
Which makes it wide, which is. Now it went away. Yeah. See, here's the problem. I can't find the button again. Oh, there it is. Yeah, it's a little rough. It's a little rough, I will say. So for unoptimized apps that
Speaker A
Yes. But like you have to intentionally like multitask that way. That takes several steps to like open it up, unfold it, open one, stroll to the side, open the other one, and then starts flipping.
Speaker A
are fully unoptimized, like Google apps or RIP Arc Search, my favorite mobile browser, which they will not update, sadly, because Arc is dead, so I need to find a new browser. It effectively uses the iPhone 18 Pro aspect ratio. Well, not the aspect ratio, but the width.
Speaker A
So good for that. Yeah, obviously you can just multitask. You could just be in one app, copy, and then swipe over and be on the next app.
Speaker A
It's the exact same width as the iPhone 18
Speaker A
And every single time I pay the ticket, I have to insert my bank info, like my routing number and my um and my account number, which is a lot of back and forth.
Speaker A
728. No, I'm kidding. Um and yeah, it's specifically with like banking apps because they like black out when you're multitasking. I have to like really remember what it is every time I go. So I can have them both open at the same
Speaker A
time and actually just type it in and it's much easier. Yeah. Or like flight information if I want to add it to flighty, that kind of stuff.
Speaker A
All very helpful. Battery life. Insanely good. You had a great battery life experience. I had like a solid battery life experience, but it seems like you were having amazing battery.
Speaker A
And again, it might be because I'm just like not opening it as much. I'm using this booklet case and this might help because the screen's on way less of the time. It's like completely off when the case is closed. My other question about
Speaker A
your use, how much like what's your ratio of open screen to close screen use?
Speaker A
Someone asked me that on Twitter. I think it's about 5050, but I don't know how much of that is the novelty of it being a folding phone.
Speaker A
Yeah, I I was kind of predicting I maybe I'm projecting a little bit in my review, but I think at first it's very fun to open it up all the time. It's very satisfying. You just like playing with the apps and stuff.
Speaker A
And then like a month or two later, especially on the candy bar shaped ones, you just start using it like a regular phone and you have to remember that you can open it.
Speaker A
And I'm curious if like I said in my review, you'd probably be like 75% outside screen, 25% inside screen. We'll see how it turns out for people.
Speaker A
Yeah. But my battery life was was pretty good. Like B+ like 6 hours of screen on time, extra battery at the end of the day and all that. Uh but a little worse than the Pro Max. But I think if I used way more
Speaker A
inside screen that might not be as good probably cuz it's more pixels to drive.
Speaker A
Now on that on that point of like the candy bar style phones, Alex had was showing me a photo on his Pixel Fold 2 or whatever it was and he he was showing me on Google Photos on his just front
Speaker A
screen and I was like dude open it up. And he was like that's so much work. So I was like why did you buy this phone?
Speaker A
The whole point of it is to open it up. Yeah. And like if you have a perfectly fine normal phone experience on the front screen, you don't have as much incentive to actually open the phone. So making it a worse experience on the
Speaker A
front display does give you incentive to use the inner display, which I understand is a totally understand that's a copout. It's like so bad that you have to use the good feature.
Speaker A
$2,000. I know. I think it like you mentioned with the flip before, it almost feels closer to a flip because of that where it's like the front screen is starting to be like the onthe-go usage and then I think people will use the inner screen
Speaker A
way more if um public transportation commute is part of your everyday life. If there's lots of things you're doing like entertainment or whatever where you don't have to be in control of anything else, you can just be fully focused on
Speaker A
your phone. Yeah. Like plane rides, whatever. Um, so that I think it'll be more and then the front is just like reply, do something, check something really fast, look at a Google map.
Speaker A
Yeah. Then you're good. Yeah. I loved that. Uh, it it was really nice in portrait, similar to the ZFold 8. There's a lot of similarities between these phones, but I really liked that that phone sort of made that behavior
Speaker A
feel more natural. It's like a small tablet in vertical. Yeah. And on this phone, this iPhone, the volume buttons are on the side. So the sort of correct orientation is like with the cameras up at the top here. The
Speaker A
volume buttons are where they would normally be on like a normal phone. Oh, true. That's a great point.
Speaker A
And Touch ID is at the top. So it's kind of like a normal iPad setup here.
Speaker A
Yeah. And I liked doing that a lot with the iPhone Duo. It it is really nice to just have basically an iPad mini in your pocket and when you're reading an article, you can just like read it on the on the
Speaker A
display. Um the volume rockers when it's closed are annoying to use. They look really annoying cuz you have to like wrap your phone around it and then just finding which one is volume down and volume up is is
Speaker A
very annoying. This whole thing from when I've seen Marquez use it is like there are so many things that they did a good job of in terms of reachability by fixing it. Yet then they still have a bunch of things
Speaker A
on it that are a pain in the neck for reachability. The fact that the swipe downs are still right, middle, and left for what? Settings, Siri, notifications.
Speaker A
Like if you were moving all the things to the right, then you should have nothing in the top left corner. That's a pain in the neck to swipe.
Speaker A
That's a hand gymnastics. Yeah. So like it feels like here's the reason why this is great. Ignore the reason why this over here is bad. We're going to forget about that.
Speaker A
Many times it is difficult to like get your notification shade to come down because you accidentally just activate Siri instead.
Speaker A
U Michael Fischer was specifically complaining about that to me. His touch target was I mean see you just did it.
Speaker A
It just pulled down Siri. Why is Siri not in a different place that's easier to do? Like a hold the power button.
Speaker A
Still do that. Wait, that does activate Siri? Yeah. Then the 2/3 of the top left should just be notifications.
Speaker A
That would be nice. Give you more room for notifications so you don't have to go all the way to the left corner.
Speaker A
I think it's because they built Siri to come out of the dynamic island on the regular iPhones.
Speaker A
So they decided to make it in the same spot on the Duo even though the selfie came. You're right. They should have changed it. This is like you there's so many polished parts that they kind of overshadow how many parts it feels like
Speaker A
they just straight up missed on. I agree. There's like a lot of things that they completely redesigned for this phone and there's some things they just didn't and like the friction between those two things makes the phone sometimes a little bit weird.
Speaker A
Yeah, there's a little more thinking. Yeah, I also will say that a lot of the hand gymnastic stuff is more annoying because the phone is slightly thicker, slightly heavier, and slightly slipperier with the titanium like curved rails. I
Speaker A
dislike the rails so much and I'm not an iPhone user so I'm not used to like the slick rails but the first time I held this I was just like oh my goodness I feel like I'm going to drop this and
Speaker A
then just to add on to all the things you said and the fact that it's a $2,000 phone you really don't want to drop.
Speaker A
Yeah. And then the ZFold 8 which is you know also basically $2,000 but it has it's thinner it's lighter and the rails are flat and matte and it's just way easier to maneuver. Like I don't find nearly as many issues with like moving
Speaker A
the phone around in my hand opening and closing it. I love using that phone because of how easy it is to [clears throat] maneuver.
Speaker A
And then of course it's Android so you can like pull down from the top and it's all the quick settings and notifications so I don't have like the reachability to the corner issue.
Speaker A
Yeah. So that's that's a big difference and that's why I kept calling it like first gen feeling hardware in my review. I think a second gen iPhone Duo in my dream world.
Speaker A
Okay, in my dream world, it has like a silicon carbon battery and like an extra camera obviously, but it also actually gets thinner, flat sides, matte, and like makes even thinner.
Speaker A
Yes, they put Face ID in if it's even thinner. I So, the thing about Face ID, [laughter] all right, so the annoying part, let's talk about that. I think a lot of people are going to miss Face ID on the iPhone
Speaker A
cuz everyone uses Face ID on their current iPhone. 100% miss it on the iPhone. Yeah.
Speaker A
The thing about the touch on the fingerprint reader, this Touch ID, is it has a built-in delay.
Speaker A
Yeah. Where you have to swipe and then touch or you can have like rest your finger there for like two whole seconds and then it opens automatically.
Speaker A
Yeah. But you still have to like wake the phone before you do it, otherwise nothing happens.
Speaker A
Yeah. And so it just feels slow. And I wish it was way faster. I wish I could remove that delay. I wish I could just like tap it, wake it up, and it opens instantly like all the Android
Speaker A
phones. I showed that in the video, too. Yeah. I I you know, and they don't do like face unlock without Face ID. That's their own philosophy. I wish they did security stuff.
Speaker A
So, now it's like I wish it had like a much faster fingerprint reader experience. It's specifically very annoying on Apple Pay because you have to double tap and then you have to like hold it and then it goes, "Oh, make sure
Speaker A
you authenticate with your fingerprint." And then you have to authenticate with your fingerprint and then you have to tap. It's like a it's like a four-step process, but it's it's just like you hold it down for a while and it goes through all
Speaker A
those one by one, but slowly. I think that's a feature because everyone who buys his phone wants the person at the cash register to know you're paying with an iPhone Duo and you need to hold it out as long as possible.
Speaker A
Yeah, it's just Yeah, Face ID is just much faster in mo most ways. And a lot of people on my on my socials have been like just unlock with Apple Watch. Just use the Apple Watch. I don't wear an
Speaker A
Apple Watch guy. Can That's what That's what they want. And they want you to be like, "Yeah, everything's easier in our ecosystem, but I don't want to wear an Apple Watch." Yeah.
Speaker A
Can you tap to pay with this open? Oh, how how much does that pay?
Speaker A
Hold on. Let me uh I was actually thinking about that. I have a flight later today and my I am for sure scanning my boarding pass like [laughter] like that's like Have you seen the people who joke with their friends at the airport
Speaker A
and they print out their boarding pass on like a poster card? Do you guys see the guy who scan he put a QR code on his bald head and then tried to [laughter] scan it to get on the train? that probably wouldn't work
Speaker A
cuz your head's curved. But yeah, it did work. So, a couple other things. I am uh I really like the apps that have been sort of optimized to just look like a Mac app, like Slack. Slack needs a little
Speaker A
bit more optimization. They actually tweeted at me today and said that they're working on it right now.
Speaker A
Please. Can you tweet at them for a couple other things that I have issues with?
Speaker A
Well, let's just use it as they did they even test this and maybe it'll get fixed. But it looks just like that map app where it's got like all your conversations on the side and then it's got the main the main thing right here.
Speaker A
Same with like Apple messages. You have like all of your contact here with the actual text here. I think that's awesome. And because of this, I really want the accessory ecosystem for this thing to get crazy.
Speaker A
So I can like have it, you know, sitting on a desk and use it with like a little mini keyboard that's specifically made for this.
Speaker A
Can I ask you really quick? So in Apple Messages, it has like your contacts on the left and the message on the right.
Speaker A
Yeah. Can you press in the where you type? What does the keyboard look like?
Speaker A
It like pops up on the whole thing. It's over the whole thing. Oh, but it does bring just the right up. I think that's fine.
Speaker A
Yeah, it just brings the right up. The Slack one looked really nice except for the black bar on the right.
Speaker A
There is a black bar on the right. That black bar drives me insane. They will almost definitely be moving the bubbles on the bottom to the right side. Um, and they said they're working on it. So, yeah. So, I I really I want all of the
Speaker A
app developers that make desktop apps to just make the unfolded experience just like the desktop app because then I want to be able to have my phone on a um on a desk and just use a little mini keyboard
Speaker A
and get some work done. If Google Docs was optimized, please Google, please. Because Safari Wait, what is Google Docs right now?
Speaker A
It's so bad. Please tell me it's one vertical page. It's the same as calendar. It's the same as calendar. It's bad. It's horrible.
Speaker A
Something like Safari is actually awesome because it literally shows all the tabs at the top just like on desktop browser. It looks just like a desktop browser.
Speaker A
I just want if and I want that for every app. I know we did, but if like a Samsung Fold did this or whatever, Twitter would be losing its mind. I mean, I'm sure there's still parts that are
Speaker A
So like Android apps, the Android version like would at least stretch it out and scale it to fit the screen.
Speaker A
Yeah. But obviously then there's like extra work that Google can do to make it really take advantage of all the space.
Speaker A
Apple is just kind of like turn it sideways. Yeah. And then you're using it wrong.
Speaker A
The consumer [clears throat] experience is better for a second gen product cuz that's what I'm hearing.
Speaker A
You mean will be better for a second gen or Yeah. Yes. No question. Hopefully. So I think that's kind of where a lot of the reviews landed which I tend to agree with. It's a firstg product. So, our early adopters, tech
Speaker A
enthusiasts, people like you and I who are excited about the fringe rough around the edges stuff like the apps being weird, like that stuff we're willing to deal with. But there's lots of other firstg products where you kind
Speaker A
of learn from the early adopters and all that stuff and then two or three generations later it starts to find itself and that's where it's good enough for regular people to buy. That's what iPad was, that's what Apple Watch was,
Speaker A
that's what MacBook Air was and I think that's what iPhone Duo is. It's going to be pro hopefully I'm fingers crossed I think it will be really good in like two or three generations.
Speaker A
Yeah. Fingers I think second gen will be better even just because way more apps will be optimized.
Speaker A
Yeah. Yeah. A lot of this stuff feels like the typical Apple move of we made all of this polish. We just we don't use any apps that are outside of our own ecosystem. So to us, we don't see how there's anything wrong with this
Speaker A
because we didn't like everything Apple works perfectly on it and everything that isn't. It just feels like even though it's first gen in the sense of it's their first gen and we talked about how there's eight years of folding
Speaker A
phones already. This feels like there's too many issues even as their first gen because of all the stuff they should be noticing from other there's still Apple apps that are not optimized.
Speaker A
Okay, I take that back then. That looks terrible. That's actually surprising that they allowed that to happen. pages. Yeah, but they still make it. I didn't even know there was a iOS.
Speaker A
But if that's the barometer cuz like Google has like 40 apps in the app store. Google's not going to update the bottom half of their apps that nobody uses with that same logic. So like I hope Google Docs gets updated, for
Speaker A
example. I really hope Google Calendar gets updated, but what about the like 17th like slideshow app that they make or whatever other random stuff? Like maybe Gemini is first and then whatever else happens happens.
Speaker A
Yeah, we'll see. Okay. The camera situation is interesting. Yes. So, the interior camera, as we've mentioned, has a hidden underd display camera. Cheeks.
Speaker A
What does that mean? Cheeks. It's bad. It's really bad. Cheeks. Okay. [laughter] I've never I don't know if I've heard that.
Speaker A
It's bad. Cheeks. I think I've heard Miles say that, but I didn't know what that is. 4 megapixels.
Speaker A
Oh, it is it really? Yeah. And it looks like it it looks pixels. Okay, that's correct. That's true. 4 million pixels.
Speaker A
4x the Dyson 4x the Dyson. Sorry, I I should rephrase. It is 4 million pixels. We're really used to way more pixels than that, though.
Speaker A
It also looks like it's shooting through a lattice fence, which it kind of is.
Speaker A
It is. Yeah, it literally is. And if it was Google Photos, they could just remove the fence.
Speaker A
So, okay, a couple of things. Call back. Um, they call it the FaceTime camera on purpose. That's because in FaceTime it actually looks pretty good because they're doing video processing.
Speaker A
They do video processing on it that kind of removes that pretty well and it looks very decent. Um it definitely has a little bit of halation and like glow because of the way the light's being bent around those lattises.
Speaker A
Yeah. But overall like when you take a photo with it, it looks like cheeks.
Speaker A
Yeah. As you would say, if there's a light source in this photo, it's like I'm holding it up me and it's like it's pretty bad. And then this little light behind me peers out 800T. Take a photo and now look at the photo.
Speaker A
It's so funny. I don't know where to look. The postprocessing is way worse. It's terrible.
Speaker A
Yeah, that looks terrible in the preview and then in the actual zoom at all. Zoom in at all and you're just like, oh, I mean, yeah, it's bad.
Speaker A
And we're in a very well. This looks like someone hacked my camera on my laptop in the middle of the podcast and like Yeah. But as you'll notice, the preview is actually pretty decent. And that's because like the video processing
Speaker A
they're doing is okay. Funny. Yeah. Um, so there's that. The rear camera is definitely worse than the 18 Pro. I saw that across the board for sure. There's so much oversharpening. It kind of feels like the iPhone camera
Speaker A
felt like four generations ago. Like it's okay. like in worse lighting. Obviously, it falls apart. And the ultra wide especially, like there's no type of sharpness in the ultra wide, but it still has the same look as the as
Speaker A
the main cameras from like an 18 Pro. The general like higher level of shadow detail and like the colors are typically the same, but the second you pixel peep, it does feel like an iPhone 15.
Speaker A
The funny thing is that the ultrawide is pretty much the same quality as the main, and that's saying something cuz ultra wide terrible. The ultride is good in the middle, but I at least from my experience mean in the middle.
Speaker A
Like in the middle. So I take an ultraide photo, the middle section of the ultraide looks fine. But then you look at anything that's not in the middle and boy is it noisy and soft and that's fine. Like you're still
Speaker A
getting the detail. That's why ultra wide they're mostly just the utility of being able to see more.
Speaker A
But yeah, it's the same ultra wide as on the 18 Pro which is which is cool. Um, but yeah, I mean ultimately they want you to take selfies either with the frontfacing camera, which actually is pretty decent or
Speaker A
or by flipping it around. Yeah. However, [laughter] and they've like said you should do this and they did make it like a cool UI interface for doing it where you switch to selfie mode and then you pull it
Speaker A
around here and slide to unlock, slide to show camera and you can do that. You can you can see the photo you're taking before you take it. But holding the phone and taking this is extremely hard.
Speaker A
It's a lot of hand gym. The natural thing you would want to do is probably do this and then it's like I'm going to drop this. Lot of hand.
Speaker A
I'm going to drop this. The only thing I found it useful for was I put on the timer and then I did this and I took a selfie of me and my friend and we put it on my backpack and it was
Speaker A
actually useful in that way. Yeah. Other than that, this is extremely hard to do and I would just recommend using the front camera.
Speaker A
I'm so glad you said that. This is one thing that didn't quite make it into my video. It made it in a little bit and I thought like if I if I hammered on this for too long, it would feel like
Speaker A
nitpicking unnecessarily, but it's just there's a lot of weird extra like hard to hold moments with the hand gymnastics. Like the camera control is the bottom corner. So if this is a righty phone like this and camera control is down here, it's a little
Speaker A
thing like I'm about to spend five minutes on the pod. If I did 5 minutes in the video, they'd be like, "Why are you still talking to us?" But like this is like kind of a weird thing, but okay.
Speaker A
You're probably turning it sideways, so it's okay. Then the volume buttons are at the top and there's this extra shuffle that you do to like get there.
Speaker A
Then what you're talking about, which is like you open it, and then you flip it around and then you get the camera open. You have to switch it to flip it over and don't touch the back screen or you might mess it up. And
Speaker A
then like slide. Okay, now you've got the controls. Now you have to not touch the the lenses and like hopefully get like a photo setup, but now your finger's in it. So maybe other hand like all this stuff. This is it's just a lot
Speaker A
of weird hand motions and stuff with this. This is why I want all of these crazy cases to come out because they're going to have like origami and that will make this easier.
Speaker A
Maybe. Yeah. What you going to say, Andrew? Uh do you know when like you're trying to take a photo and someone comes up to you and you're like, "Would you like me to take a photo of you guys?" You're
Speaker A
going to be like, "You don't know how?" No, not even you don't know how. Like I don't trust you holding this thing like right now. You're going to drop this or I would be like, "Just kidding. I'm not
Speaker A
Okay. Best case scenario, you you set it up for them, right? So, you open it up, you open the camera app, you turn on duo preview so that you can see that they're going to do it, right? And then you hand
Speaker A
it to them like this and go, "All right, a little higher." And then you can get the exact shot you want.
Speaker A
Except now that somebody offers you, and then they direct me for like 10 minutes, I was like, "I was doing you all a favor. Let's chill out here." Yeah. So, yeah, I hope that they had a telephoto in the next one. Um, I wish
Speaker A
they could have a a bigger sensor, but that's just not going to be possible, I don't think. Unless they figure out some special physics, but who knows? Right now, I'm like really missing the telephoto lens, but I also
Speaker A
really missed it on the iPhone Air, and that's just a compromise. Yeah, I think the battery is good enough that they can use extra room to add a camera. Yeah, like the telephoto.
Speaker A
I kind of agree with that. Yeah. And they'll just be like, well, the A21 Pro is even more efficient, so it's even more battery life. Do you guys miss this has fusion camera?
Speaker A
Seven lenses in my pocket. This is the other thing and maybe they should have called it the Duo Pro or something, but they don't have Pro Raw and they don't have ProRes and they don't have it. Well, they have promotion
Speaker A
obviously, but they don't have any of those like Pro features on the Pro phone. And I understand they still have to sell Pro iPhones.
Speaker A
Mhm. But the Pro iPhone is half the price of this thing. And I just think if you make the most expensive thing you should make should have all the features of the ones below it price-wise. Mhm. So, yeah,
Speaker A
there's no reason they couldn't have done Pro RAW. They took it out. It's the same processor as the Pros.
Speaker A
They should be able to do that stuff. Just gated it. Get better features on a thing that costs $1,000 less.
Speaker A
Yeah, that seems insane. That's a very valid take. It's just the Yeah, the pro iPhone has to get the pro stuff.
Speaker A
I know, but it is a pro iPhone. It's just not, you know. Yeah. It's like if you're the iPhone filmmaker in that specific way of being a pro iPhone user, then you obviously get the one with the better cameras.
Speaker A
Even though real filmmakers like 4x3 more than they like uh 21x9. Yeah. So, it's also are you going to edit on the phone or not? Cuz if you are, then maybe you do get the one with the worst
Speaker A
cameras cuz it has the better screen to edit on. Well, I don't know. This is a better screen to edit on. That's what I'm saying.
Speaker A
Yeah. Maybe that's their plan. So, you buy the iPhone 18 Pro Max to film everything and then transfer it all to your iPhone Duo to then edit on the inside.
Speaker A
No one's editing on that thing. I'm not going to edit on that. Somebody out somebody out there who doesn't like there is a generation right now that does not have a computer that like does everything on their phone and
Speaker A
this is kind of sick for that. Apparently, Cap Cut on the inner display is actually really useful because you can see the full time. You can see the full timeline on the right and then you can see your your face.
Speaker A
Is it optimized already? Yeah. Yeah, there's a couple good on a few. And I will say on optimized apps, developers out there, I'm looking for alternatives for a lot of my apps right now. So, if you make a good alternative
Speaker A
to like popular apps, tweet at me or like email me cuz I will try it.
Speaker A
[snorts] I really want to find cuz like if you're optimized first, I'm going to try it.
Speaker A
There's some that I'm like I use every day and I I can't. It's just sucks. It's so bad.
Speaker A
All right, here's a take I want to ask you about that I've seen a couple places. Mhm.
Speaker A
Apple introduced this feature recently that is basically like the ability to hot swap your phone number/data plan like quickly between iPhones. I forget what it's called. Handoff.
Speaker A
Yeah. And I saw people saying that they launched this around the Duo or the Air in the last year so that people could switch between a more experimental iPhone and then their main iPhone more quickly and then they own two iPhones
Speaker A
and then do two iPhone stuff back and forth between like like a weekend iPhone and a workday iPhone.
Speaker A
Apple doesn't live in reality. Is that is that a valid theory or what do you think of that? I look, I miss the camera features on my Pro, but I'm not going to buy two pro two iPhones. One
Speaker A
that's $2,000 and one that's $1,200. Look, but it's only $35 a month. Yeah, think about it. You're You're an Apple.
Speaker A
I don't think it's 35. You're in the boardroom. They're like, "Guys, we have a problem. We've saturated the market. Pretty much everyone who's gonna buy an iPhone has bought an iPhone except for Alex. Um, who just could Anyway, how do we get
Speaker A
people to buy two iPhones? Yeah. I I don't I don't know about that. I mean, it's a it's obviously a feature that is only useful for people with two iPhones, but then people were speculating on the timing of the release
Speaker A
of the feature. It's like, oh, this would have been cool with the when the mini came out cuz the mini, I don't know, people didn't want to like fully dedicate their life to the mini, but what if it was just like a like a
Speaker A
daytime phone and then on like it's insane. The mini is like one inch diagonally smaller. It's not even that small.
Speaker A
But the fact that no one not enough people bought it and they had to discontinue it. They're like maybe more people would have given it a shot if they could have like swapped back and forth. Maybe. Do you remember the Palm
Speaker A
Phone? The new Palm phone? Yeah. That feels like a one in screen. Yeah. 1.6.
Speaker A
Yeah. But they it was the same idea. It was like you had to pay an extra money to have the same phone number and you it was your weekend phone where you couldn't do anything on it.
Speaker A
Yeah. It was the same idea, but like lit Yeah. Literally couldn't do lots of things on it.
Speaker A
Yeah. I mean, you could cuz it had Google Play and Android, but it was What if we just like take the SIM card and we put it in the other phone?
Speaker A
Oh, there's no SIM card. Yeah, I know. Yeah. I I don't know about that. The only thing I could try and think of is if like you have if your work phone and your phone happen to be the same, but
Speaker A
like you want a work phone to be specifically not the same. Like I So I feel like that's Look, I miss I miss the camera features on the 18 Pro, but I would rather just own this and then bring a real camera.
Speaker A
Yeah. Yeah. The I I cut a section again from the review is the report card section. It's a 30-minute review already, so I don't have time for it. But uh the little report card thing that I did with the
Speaker A
MacBook Neo and the and the Google books. So I was going to do that again.
Speaker A
And for the I got halfway into writing it and I was like what do I do for the creator?
Speaker A
Because it is a worse camera but it is a better everything else. Yeah. Right.
Speaker A
Like the screen on the inside for watching your videos back for editing for publishing. Like when those apps are optimized it's better at everything else but the cameras are worse. So is this better for a creator than the 18 Pro?
Speaker A
Some of the creators maybe. Fun fact, I shot the whole Tesla Roadster reaction video on the iPhone Duo. There were a few comments, maybe two or three that I noticed like, "Oh, what phone did you shoot this on?" But there was 20,000
Speaker A
comments about the subject of the video, not the phone that I shot it on. And I think that that's probably the the overall theory is that if the story is good enough, if the video is good enough, it doesn't matter what you shoot
Speaker A
it on. Yeah. But question, did you shoot it with the back camera? No, that's again too much hand gymnastics. I just did my old trusty this.
Speaker A
Yeah, so you did with the back camera but not back camera closed with no viewfinder.
Speaker A
Trust trust. Pure trust. Looks like it's facing me. Must be facing me cuz I took I was in Montreal this weekend and I took a very beautiful video of the fall foliage, but um the bottom part of the screen just had my
Speaker A
finger in it. So I'm surprised that you didn't have that issue. [laughter] Oh, I I've gotten used to I've shot so many autofocus videos that I know like how to hold a phone and like avoid that issue. If I was like trying to do the
Speaker A
right side of the phone, it'd be hard. So, you're saying I was holding it wrong?
Speaker A
Yeah, you're holding it wrong. Yeah, exactly. It fail as old as time. It fail as old as time. Well, I'm super excited for the accessory ecosystem on this. One thing I did notice, Mag Safe, it has, but a lot of Mags Safe accessories don't
Speaker A
really work very well for it. Explain. Because of the size. So, the size. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker A
Yeah. The size. So, for example, I have a MagSafe charger at home that it's like it's a flat charger. And because of the positioning of Mags Safe on this with the way that the bump or the plateau or
Speaker A
whatever is, it bumps up against the plateau constantly and it's like hard to get on the charger. And you can technically get it on there, but it doesn't feel like it fits flush on there. The other thing is my car, I
Speaker A
guess this is not Mag Safe, but my car has uh chargers that are oriented for 21 by9 phones, 20 21 by 9 phones.
Speaker A
Mhm. And it just can't charge my phone. That's good cuz most cars are going to have it more narrow cuz it doesn't want to slide around when you're And that's not there. Any wireless charger that is like at an angle and has your phone sitting
Speaker A
up at an angle that does not have Mag Safe will just not work for this phone because it's just too short. Yeah, I assume most like uh wallets as well that are Mag Safe will not fit.
Speaker A
And the battery banks, they'll be too big. Yeah. Well, yeah. Even if they do fit with the plateau, they're going to hang off the bottom and just look like hell.
Speaker A
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, even Apple's own like uh iPhone Airbug is just not going to work on this.
Speaker A
So, Apple's going to have to develop new accessories. Uh manufacturers are going to have to develop accessories just for the Duo.
Speaker A
Wonder if they will or how many they will cuz like does it sell that well? So limited supply like how many people are really going to have this is the other thing I wanted to talk about is that we made this like sort of
Speaker A
bet which we will never that bet is null because we will never be able to tell what happened.
Speaker A
Correct. It is invalid because their demand was way way way way ahead of supply.
Speaker A
Mhm. Uh above supply but that's all we know. We don't know how we don't know how many they made.
Speaker A
Yeah. [clears throat] So like pre-orders are moved until like January or February. I've seen February. Some some people are reporting they're getting them like pushed forward after they had a long, but I still know plenty of people who
Speaker A
are like this is a February. Yeah, within like 10 minutes a lot of people got pushed to January.
Speaker A
And Apple is saying our I mean Apple would always say our demand's insane, but it seems like the demand is insane, but also we have no idea how many they made. Yeah. So, we can't really actually see if my bet was correct or not.
Speaker A
No. Yeah. I also think it could like lose some sales because people are like I think so many people ordering this want to order this because it's the new flashy iPhone thing and like there's a status symbol to this. But if you have
Speaker A
it 3 months late and that's the person you want to be. Yeah. You've kind of lost the like it's nowhere near as much fun anymore.
Speaker A
Yeah. And at $2,000 if you're willing to pay that to be the flashy like gadget, you don't want it 3 months later.
Speaker A
It's kind of the crazy thing like you you think about it again. They're like, "Wow, this starts at $2,000 and then after tax and everything." And it's like, if you're already going to buy a foldable phone and you're already
Speaker A
prepared to spend that money, then it's like, yeah, it's a great I mean, it's the it's the iPhone foldable. It's awesome.
Speaker A
Yeah. But $2,000 on a phone is still an insane amount of money no matter how you slice it. Um, so when you could get a Pro iPhone for 1,200 brand new, it's kind of like it's a little difficult to buy a
Speaker A
Gen One product. Yeah. Yeah. My favorite line in a review that wasn't mine was uh in the Veres review, Nei mentioned that every once in a while he find himself going back to his iPhone 18 Pro to do something real quick and it
Speaker A
was like a relief. Oh. And I felt I felt that a little bit just like the Slab phone is the better phone, right, for most people. Better cameras for 20 years.
Speaker A
It's been optimized. All the apps were per work perfectly. The battery life is great. Like you're not making those trade-offs. You have all three cameras.
Speaker A
It's just the better, safer, easier phone for most people to get. And it's just if you want to be at that bleeding edge, then you will take the risk and you will clearly have a worse experience with some things and then you get the
Speaker A
satisfying other fun stuff that comes with that. What is kind of exciting about this existing though is that I think phones that are this size or at least that are foldable in this way are just going to go way more mainstream in
Speaker A
general. Yeah. Because now that Apple makes this, I mean all these Android manufacturers already make them, but the the volume they ship is very low, but I think that Android foldable phone volume will go up and also now Apple is like d like
Speaker A
they're doubling down on this, right? Yeah. So, I think that the form factor of a phone will not be as clearcut in 5 years. It'll be like there's this phone and then there's this phone.
Speaker A
I think that's awesome. Oh, that that was one one other thing I was wondering. Do you think that there will be multiple versions of the duo in the future?
Speaker A
Oh god, please no. You don't think so? I think we have a possible future. Like whenever certain cars come out, you're like, "Well, I know they're going to make a convertible version later, so I'm going to wait." Like, is there going to
Speaker A
be a Duo Pro like one with triple cameras? I think it needs to last the two years, the two generations first and make sure it doesn't get killed and then we'll start talking about that.
Speaker A
That would have to be like three grand. Yeah. No, they're not gonna have any problem with that. They're happy to sell something three grand.
Speaker A
Interesting. I don't know. I don't know. Anyway, that's kind of the the thoughts. You should watch the review. It's 30 minutes long.
Speaker A
I really liked your comparison of it to Vision Pro of like they did all of these things that makes this feel so high quality and so many things they did, right? Like how great the glass looks on the the Vision Pro, how great the
Speaker A
clicking experience was, like Yeah. And then when you start using it, you're like, I kind of wish I had some of the not polished things because usability-wise, they're just better.
Speaker A
Yeah. Yeah. Well, we'll see. Developers, developers, developers, and then second gen. We'll see how it goes. That's the whole story. That could have been an alternate title. iPhone review.
Speaker A
Developers, developers, developers. Wait for the second gen. Get Steve Balmer in here ASAP. Yeah. All right. Techtober is a thousand years long. Keep skating. This is pretty quick though cuz I think we've talked about it a billion times already.
Speaker A
Pro and tell. Pro and tell. Really? I like I was an okay one. Every single one of their event invites is a really cheesy.
Speaker A
I know, but that this one's worse. I I They're all Well, it's sort of It's clear what we're about to get, which is a new Pro device. And we seem to all be on the same page that the headliner will
Speaker A
be a brand new MacBook Pro. You don't think it'll be a HomePod Pro Mini?
Speaker A
I would bet anything. Um, and there's also iPad mini OLED refresh updates uh that are sort of floating around as well. But I think the thing I'm interested in and what the invite kind of references is a touchscreen OLED
Speaker A
MacBook Pro. Um, now what will you do with the touchscreen MacBook Pro? I don't really know yet. Will it be pencil support or just finger support? I don't really know yet. Will it be 10 bazillion dollars? I don't really know yet.
Speaker A
It has to have pencil support. It has to. It has to. seems likely, but also the iPhone Duo is just now getting a software update to 27.2 that enables pencil support for a pencil that wasn't made for it.
Speaker A
And everyone kind of wants like a pencil made for the Duo instead of just using like an old iPad pencil for it.
Speaker A
Yeah. Yeah. Is there going to be a new pencil for a MacBook Pro? I don't know if I want to use the old ones for it. I don't know yet. I mean, I still think that they didn't even need to do the touchcreen
Speaker A
and they could have just added pencil support to the enormous haptic trackpad because it's basically the same price as like a small the same size as a small Wacom tablet.
Speaker A
Trackpad is interesting, too. They should have done that so long ago there, but that the technology is different in a screen and how it senses versus like this metal trackpad. It's really good for fingers. I don't know.
Speaker A
See, there's a lot of questions we don't know. It is hard to do. pencil support on a screen means the hinge like touching is one thing but drawing this hinge would need to be and there are rumors that
Speaker A
there is a reinforced hinge to accommodate it but like if you're doing a lot of drawing with a pencil on the screen the it has to be rock solid almost like a kickstand on the back in order to use
Speaker A
this as a Is the only one who uses a tablet to draw stuff? Does Olivia not use one?
Speaker A
Does she too? So we have two tablet users I don't know. I think I'm going to have to give it to them because like the main thing I've talked about this in videos before. I there's lots of touchscreen
Speaker A
laptops already. I never find myself using the touchcreen for anything other than a scroll once in a while cuz it just wobbles back and forth. MacBook Pros are pretty sturdy, but across the spectrum of laptops, there's all kinds
Speaker A
of wobbling hinges. So, I just don't use the touchcreen. Yeah. But the newest highest end crazy stuff coming out like these RTX Spark Surface Ultra laptops, they're all touchcreens.
Speaker A
They're all like incredible like tandem OLED displays. Apple is going to catch up with that tech and they're going to offer it, but then like why would I want to do it? They might have to explain that to users in some extra way we
Speaker A
haven't seen yet. Yeah. Which is exciting. Um I'm excited for us to get a bajillion views for like multiple months.
Speaker A
Pretty nice. People want to know. People want to know. There's going to be a nanoexture text touchcreen.
Speaker A
I imagine there will be cuz the nanoexture on the inside of the Duo feels so Yeah, that's better. And there's some iPads with it now, right? I I feel like I'm still stuck in the nanoexture of Proisplay XTR which is like do not don't
Speaker A
you dare touch that or else you will never it will never be the same.
Speaker A
I think the same way like we had those pro displays like nanoextures come a long way those early ones horrible never touch them and then they made a nanoexture iPad and I was like oh that's okay and then we used it and we're like
Speaker A
oh this is actually great dope and now it's on the phone which I've you know everyone uses all the time so I think they can do it on a laptop. I still don't think this one's very good for touching. Obviously, it's not made
Speaker A
for touching, but I'm pointing out my MacBook Pro, which has nanoexture. Yeah. So, it gets dirty. We'll see if they do a different version of that.
Speaker A
Yeah. One of the rumors is that they're skipping M6 Pro and Max chips. So, do we think this is going to be M5?
Speaker A
Skipping M6 Pro and Max. Uh, so yeah, cuz we got M6 previously. I mean, M5 Pro and M5 Max are A+ chips.
Speaker A
So, I wouldn't be surprised if it had those. So, do you think this is going to be a MacBook Ultra that's like its own category or do we think all MacBook Pros are just going to be this OLED
Speaker A
touchcreen dynamic island? Two things. Mhm. One, I think it's it lives separately from the rest of the lineup.
Speaker A
You okay? It's the touchcreen one. But two, they never call it what we think they're going to call it.
Speaker A
So, if we all think it's going to be the Ultra, that's the only thing that they won't call it. Yeah.
Speaker A
I don't know what they're going to name it, but it won't be what we think.
Speaker A
Okay. But you think it will have a distinct name that's outside the It's like its own skew.
Speaker A
It's strange cuz everyone's saying it's going to be called the MacBook Pro. I think it might just be the MacBook Pro and Pro is going to also include touch now.
Speaker A
Yeah. I feel like usually it's just like an add-on. It doesn't feel in my brain like it's an entire separate skew, but it's also Apple. When you say add-on, you mean there will be like this ver this normal M5 version
Speaker A
where you add a touch. I think all the Pros will have the touchcreen and just the Air will not have the touch screen because I think it's also OLED. I don't think they're going to make an OLED non-touchreen. Yeah.
Speaker A
And I don't think they're going to have what is this again? MiniLEDD. MicroLEDD. I think this is mini LED.
Speaker A
MiniLEDD and O. I don't think they're going to have the same MacBook Pro lineup with miniLEDD and OLED. Like two totally different screens. just to get not touchreen.
Speaker A
Yeah, I think this Yeah, I think this lands at the top of the lineup above the current MacBook Pro with it with its own. I mean, some Windows OEMs will like make multiple SKs of the same laptop like this one has OLED, this
Speaker A
one's IPS, this one's blah blah blah, but Apple generally does not. I was going to say that's that's Windows.
Speaker A
They try to Yeah, they try to make it like simplified for the customer to understand what they're getting in general.
Speaker A
Sorry, I'm thinking like a Windows user. I know. I know. I know. Yeah. Um I don't know. Yeah, I'm going to just because you guys are doing that, I'm going to say these are just the new MacBook Pros. They're just
Speaker A
OLED with touch. I think I agree with that. Yeah, I think that would be nice. That would really be this like I mean they needed the second half of 2026.
Speaker A
Apple really needed a a new differentiating factor for the MacBook Pros because the M chips, yeah, they're getting faster and they're getting better, but they're beyond what most people can use them for already. So, they need reasons to sell new SKs.
Speaker A
It's a hilarious problem to have. The M1's freaking good. Lobster too buttery. Yeah, [laughter] it's just like stick with your M1 again.
Speaker A
Yeah, exactly. So, so anyway, that's next week. By the time you listen to this, it's just a couple days, which is also that iPad Mini apparently might have a $200 price increase.
Speaker A
Yeah. Which it sucks because I mean it's going to be a better iPad mini, but I want them to offer a lower priced one, which I understand probably can't be a high-end OLED display, but I just want a
Speaker A
cheap iPad mini. Like, that's a nice little computer option to have. An iPad Mini and an iPad Mini Pro. give us the like I love I kind of wanted that a while ago. I wanted an iPad mini pro
Speaker A
and this feels like it's going that although OLED but possibly still 60 Hz. Here's my conspiracy theory take.
Speaker A
Oh, they better not be 60 Hz. [laughter] They better not do that. Conspiracy theory take because the iPhone duo is an iPhone and an iPad mini.
Speaker A
They needed to make the iPad mini more expensive because currently it is cheaper to buy an iPhone and an iPad mini. And if they make it more expensive, it'll be around the same price. and then you go, "Oh, well, why
Speaker A
wouldn't I just buy two in one?" There's no way that hasn't happened in an Apple meeting. They definitely have thought that. That is really funny.
Speaker A
It's been in a media. I do not think it's the reason why it's going to be more expensive.
Speaker A
Yeah, but it's also Yeah, like if I want right now, if I want a 7 in 120 Hz OLED display from Apple, the iPhone is the only way to get it. But if Apple can sell you an iPhone and a high-end iPad
Speaker A
mini, they would rather also sell you two things. So, they would happily sell that as well.
Speaker A
Yeah. Well, we'll find out pretty soon. All right. Well, next on the podcast after the break, we're going to talk about the most controversial thing that's ever happened in history.
Speaker A
I don't think the Mission S is that controversial. Oh, I was talking about the Big Bang.
Speaker A
Oh, right. Well, we'll get there. In the meantime, trivia. All right, guys. Earlier you were talking about Google apps that you think might not ever get official iPhone Duo support.
Speaker A
Yeah, all of them. I scoured the internet and I can tell you that on the iOS app store, Google has listed 71 Damn applications.
Speaker A
That's a lot. 71. 71. I thought it was 40ome. It's a lot. What I need you guys to do Oh boy.
Speaker A
Oh my god. Many. No. No. No. No. Okay. as many as possible. Write down just one but one Google app and whichever one of your apps was last updated the longest ago gets the point for this question.
Speaker A
Can I throw same question but a potential for three points? I'm interested. You can pick you have to write down three of the apps but if any of your apps match one of the other persons, you lose.
Speaker A
No. Three of these apps were updated today. So, don't pick those. Bug fixes and improvements.
Speaker A
That's exciting. But not Duo support, unfortunately. Well, we'll think about that. Answers will be at the end like usual. We'll be right back.
Speaker A
[music] Support for the show comes from Framer. The future of website building is one that seamlessly blends all the tools we have available. And you should use a platform that has it all and stays useful even after you launch. That's
Speaker A
what framer is. Framer is the AI website builder that helps creators, teams, and businesses ship productionready websites faster than ever while getting every detail right. You're able to prompt, inspect, edit, and publish in one place at a whole new pace. On Framer, agents
Speaker A
and humans work in tandem. [music] So, agents bring speed and scale, while people bring taste, judgment, and control. And that all takes place in the same workspace where the real site is designed managed reviewed and published. Everyone's ideas land on the
Speaker A
canvas, stay editable, and can [music] be published when the team is ready. Framer is an enterprise level solution.
Speaker A
So thousands of businesses from early stage startups to Fortune 500s [music] are choosing to build their websites in Framer, where changes take minutes instead of days. Learn how you can get more out of your site from a Framer
Speaker A
specialist or get started building for free today at framer.com/wave for 30% off a Framer Pro annual plan.
Speaker A
That's framer.com/wave. [music] Rules and restrictions may apply. All right, welcome back. Let's talk about the other event that happened between the last podcast episode and now uh the new car.
Speaker A
I want to reiterate there. Yeah, between the last like there were so many comments last week. They're like, "Why don't you guys cover the Tesla Roadster?
Speaker A
Why didn't you I can't believe they didn't delay the recording. Cover the Roadster." The podcast was uploaded before the event started. We released at 4:00 a.m. on Friday. By the time we finished recording, we would have been due.
Speaker A
Yeah. Yeah. That being said, I did put a video out reacting to it and explaining all my thoughts the next morning, but there are so many more things to talk about, and so we will. Uh, Tesla Roadster. Tesla had their Roadster event
Speaker A
again, finally. The one that was delayed and then delayed again, and then delayed again. It happened. It was October 15th.
Speaker A
And it was pretty insane. Uh, where do I even start? So, they announced the new look of the Roadster. Looks totally different. They've made a completely different car. And uh all this talk, all this hype about it being a SpaceX collab
Speaker A
turned out to be true because that's the one thing that they demoed. They had people attend in real life to witness the car drive up a giant halfpipe looking ramp and then upside down and then flip off of it and do like a barrel
Speaker A
roll and land on its tires and drive away. It did a huge jump over a bunch of Tesla products.
Speaker A
Cake flip. It was pretty crazy. Can you describe the car first for if somehow you did not see this video in the last?
Speaker A
Okay. So, for podcast audio only listeners, picture a midmodern Lamborghini. Not like the latest Lamborghinis, but like a Gallardo or a not a Countach, but a little newer like an old Huracan. It's like a wedge-shaped car with like triangles everywhere. The
Speaker A
headlights are triangles. It's a very like low poly type of like aggressive look. Cybertruck supercar. I think Cybertruck will get comps a lot cuz it's again very low poly and it's only one color. It's just that's what I wanted to ask. It's only
Speaker A
that color. I haven't seen any other color. Okay. I haven't either. I was wondering if it's only silver and it's like the Cybertruck route of like it's pretty defined lines.
Speaker A
Guys, this is this is product questions and details. Okay, we're not going to know stuff about colors for that's what this podcast is for.
Speaker A
I'm just describing what I saw, you know. Um, but yeah, then it's got these like pop down headlights. And then at the back there's this huge active rear wing. And then the back of the car has these exhaust pipes and fans, which
Speaker A
it's an EV. There's no exhaust. Yeah, you're probably thinking, why is there exhaust pipes on this car? Uh, and that's because there are cold gas thrusters positioned all around the car.
Speaker A
So, I think the easiest way to understand this is there's four trims of the Tesla Roadster. This is this is how you can you can go to their website.
Speaker A
Like, they didn't this is the problem. And they didn't say this at the event, but there are four trims of the Tesla Roadster. The base Tesla Roadster is just the EV, 100 kWh battery pack, whatever, rear wheel drive or 1 megawatt
Speaker A
of power, which is 1300 horsepower. Just a fast EV. And that was we only found that out because of the interviews some of the engineers did later. It is not listed on the website. We don't actually have any
Speaker A
specs on what it we're just assuming it is car that looks like Roadster. Big shout out to Hagerty, Motor Trend, and Top Gear who all asked lots of interesting questions of Lars and Fron after the or before the event and like publish their
Speaker A
videos. This is where most of my information comes from. So, there's the base Roadster. Then there's the performance version of the Roadster, which has a fan system underneath. The fan system, if you haven't seen the Mc Merry Spearling, is basically just a
Speaker A
huge set of fans at the back of the car that are connected to the bottom of the car that suck the air out from under the car, creates a low pressure zone, pulls the car into the ground, and gives it
Speaker A
multiples of grip. It's great. Makes it corner really fast and gives it grip where other cars don't have because active arrow needs a lot of speed. Then there's the thruster version of the car which has that and adds four rocket
Speaker A
thrusters to the back of the car. They're connected to a 200 L uh carbon overwrapped pressure vessel that's sitting right behind the driver's head and holds about 100 kg of compressed nitrogen at about 10,000 PSI that can burst for about four to 5
Speaker A
seconds, send you 0 to 60 in under one second, and then it's empty. Then there's the highest end rocket version of the car, which adds another double-sized 400 L carbon over pressure vessel in the passenger seat next to the
Speaker A
driver, making it a one-seater, and also adds six other thrusters around the car facing down and facing sideways for yaw control. And that's the one that performed, you know, the crazy trick that could theoretically jump or turn in
Speaker A
midair. That one on their website says it's by invite only and uh is not approved for public use obviously.
Speaker A
Yeah, the thrust version is limited and then the performance one you can just reserve. They are performance is 5,000 down now, 45,000 due in 10 days.
Speaker A
Thrust is 5,000 down now, 245,000 due in 10 days. And then we don't know base or rocket pricing.
Speaker A
Yeah. So, all of that is pretty theoretical because again, this car was announced like many many years ago and now it's uh pushed to 2028 and still doesn't exist. We saw that one demo car.
Speaker A
They did a couple demos in front of people in front of a live audience, but like still I I sort of uh ended my impressions video of the event saying, "Look, fool me once, shame on you. Fool me
Speaker A
twice, won't get fooled again." No, won't get fooled again. I obviously have been waiting for Roadster for a long time and you know they they do this big show, this crazy demo. It is no is no question an incredible demo and like
Speaker A
a really fun thing to for people to watch. And then the product itself, like details just don't make it out. Like that's not even important to this at all.
Speaker A
Well, hold on. You did you did leave out three really important details about the car from this.
Speaker A
Um the first is that and these are uh exact quotes. Um, the car will be sentient.
Speaker A
U, that's an exact quote about the roadster. That was a tweet later. That was a tweet later.
Speaker A
Yeah. Um, it will be able to perform all of those uh maneuvers autonomously. So, there will in theory be no control system for the the Roadster. And at Tesla HQ, they are building a life-sized Hot Wheels track for Roadster owners to
Speaker A
perform any of these stunts themselves. In fact, the exact quote is crazier even than Hot Wheels.
Speaker A
Yeah. One other thing is Elon said on stage live during the event, uh, they just sort of like asked how fast should the top speed be because they're sort of reannouncing all the specs. And you know, if you ask Fron or Lars in the
Speaker A
engineering sessions, they were like, "It'll go 230, it'll go 235, it'll go 250 or whatever." And then Elon goes, "I think it should be able to go half the speed of sound." [laughter] Uh, which for those who are doing the
Speaker A
quick math, yeah, that's 380 mph, which no production car has ever done, and it'll be probably 50 years before another car like even gets close to that. Tires can't do that right now.
Speaker A
It's just not going to happen. Uh, but he did say that on stage. Um, so yeah, where do we even start? I guess the main thing everyone's wondering is why should it do that?
Speaker A
Let's start at just the three demos and like in a vacuum. Yeah. What the three demos were They were impressive and also raised some questions.
Speaker A
Okay, so the fan car demo, that first one, driving up this super smooth ramp and then coming back down because it's a fan car.
Speaker A
Mhm. Really cool demo. Not the first time we've seen it. The McMerry Spearing that I mentioned earlier is a fan car that's been in development very publicly and on social media for a long time, which is also an EV. It's also a super
Speaker A
lightweight, incredibly crazy sports car. Um, and they have literally driven it upside down before because the amount of suction that it creates is more than the mass of the car. So, it can drive upside down. It's a cool demo obviously,
Speaker A
but like the practical application of that, if you watch the McMerry Spear Spearling videos, is that car has so much grip all of the time in a way that active arrow can't that it can it literally can snap like three or four gs
Speaker A
of lateral acceleration, which you'd never see from just tires. So, it's it's really really great. It breaks track records every time. Uh, it's kind of like a cheat code. It's insane.
Speaker A
That's I think that's an important note, too, is track records. This thing is it's active arrow underneath the car.
Speaker A
It's suction. Like, these things can only be done on a track. And even still, the track has to be perfectly maintained, smooth track. I mean, presumably it has mesh and a filter system to not suck up too much stuff, but like
Speaker A
this cannot be used on an average road. Yeah, they're really loud. I don't know if you've seen the videos of the Spearling, but they're super the fans they turn them on, there's like a dial of like 10,000 20,000 RPM and like you
Speaker A
hear the fans spin up and it's crazy loud. Uh, and then it just just accelerates in this like 1.4 seconds 0 to 60 this burst and it's just insane to watch. Um, but yeah, it is. It has this
Speaker A
like skirt system that drops down underneath the car to create like a like a suction area for that low pressure zone. Yeah, like a pressure vacuum. So, it's really really cool. It's a science experiment we've seen in development.
Speaker A
And it almost doesn't surprise me that like Tesla comes along with this like big pockets and is just like, "Oh yeah, we'll do that, too." And then they just throw a bunch of engineering talent at it and they're like, "All right, now
Speaker A
ours can do the same thing." So, that is the first demo that we saw. It was cool driving up the wall really tall like Ellis said, a halfpipe turned on its side.
Speaker A
So, it's like literally perfectly vertical and it's just sitting there. That was the first demo. And then the next demo, it does that again except drives off the upside down part of the top as one does, flips over and falls down and you see
Speaker A
all the cold gas thrusters shooting all over the place and falling with style down to the ground. If you just take what we watched at face value, then we just watched a 3,000 4,000lb object fly through the air and then land. Uh I
Speaker A
almost don't even want that to exist on the street. If you've seen the way if you obviously it will never exist on the street. It's not street legal, but like the demos that they're doing don't have much practical application. They're just
Speaker A
sick demo basically. So you can't jump over traffic. You can't jump off a bridge to avoid the traffic on the bridge onto another highway overpass or whatever. Like, you can't actually do that anywhere. That's why they will have
Speaker A
to build some sort of a private track for rocket roadster owners to demo this thing because that's the only place you can actually use it. Uh they did the demo hundreds of yards away from the live audience and gave them hearing
Speaker A
protection because the thrusters are so loud it would be really really hard to like listen to that in person. Really, really loud stuff. So, obviously not street legal, but uh I think when people watch that, they think, well, some
Speaker A
fraction of people go, "Oh, that's never going to happen. That's never going to hit the road." But some other fraction of people think, "Oh, that's cool. They can jump over traffic." I can't really get a gauge on who really
Speaker A
thinks that or who just wants to make the coolest AI video on Twitter about jumping over police cars or they're all memes.
Speaker A
Yeah, they're Yeah, they all feel like memes were incredible. The memes have been incredible. I wouldn't be surprised if there's people who think that singular thrust is going to be like street legal, which I don't I'm wondering how they're going to do
Speaker A
all of this. Are they going to have to geofence like these features? Cuz that's not something you can just be like, "Oh, it's illegal to use on the street cuz some idiot's going to do it." Like remember when David Dori launched the
Speaker A
Model X off that like San Francisco? Oh yeah. That would be in the Pacific Ocean if it had like if they did the thrusters. Um, so like we can't let people out there even attempt to try and use this thing
Speaker A
illegally. Dude, are you a communist? Apparently I've seen so there's different in the sports car world there's different levels of how restricted not street legal things have been.
Speaker A
So sometimes there's a mode in the car called track mode and there's a little fine print that says do not use on public streets but you can just turn it on and do it anyway. Yeah, it's probably not illegal, but it's like
Speaker A
not recommended and the car will like not have the liability because it told you not to do it.
Speaker A
Then there's things like uh you might remember the W1 video. Uh cars are not allowed to have like things overhanging the back bumper. So if you do, you need some sort of flag on it. Like if you're towing like some wars or whatever, you
Speaker A
need a flag. So it had this big wing, this LT wing that extended over the back bumper. That's not street legal. You can't have it extend over the back bumper. So they gate that to race mode and then they gate race mode to GPS
Speaker A
locations of tracks and drag strips only. So you literally can't enable that feature on a public street which is another version of this. Um there's all sorts of little stuff like that. Like uh this concept car had no windshield
Speaker A
wipers, had no side view mirrors. Uh Lars or maybe it was Fron suggested that you could like attach the windshield wiper whenever you want and then detach it whenever you want. And same thing with side view mirrors. I talk about
Speaker A
this all the time. I think those that's one of those cases where you have to sell the car with the thing that's required and then you can make it user removable later. That's another version. Um but yeah, for a
Speaker A
10,000 PSI cold gas container behind the driver to expel a bunch of gas, I feel like they should really restrict that to not be possible anywhere other than a drag strip.
Speaker A
Yeah, that seems like the only place you'd use that. And then in terms of the like the kickflip demo, Yeah.
Speaker A
First of all, the most real life Rocket League thing it clearly was there. But like when we think of flying, we think of this like gradual takeoff and this like lifted and then as it's flipping looks really strange because you can tell so
Speaker A
much of the thrusters are like calibrating itself mid-flight to be like okay overrect undercorrect figure it out, land nicely, which looks like the boost rockets in Rocket League where you're like trying to direct yourself to the ball. correctly. Less
Speaker A
like flying, more like I I don't even know how to des like midair maneuvering.
Speaker A
Yeah. Um and that I want to bring up the the quote Ellis said before. Elon responded to somebody saying that like you will be able to do this autonomously. My first thought in that was is this only going
Speaker A
to be able to be done autonomously? The more I hear, the more I think so. I think this is going to be a party trick that you launch with your phone out of the way because a person inside of that
Speaker A
thing even if it lands perfectly even just the like jerking your head around like trying to keep in there even if it lands perfectly fine like an RC car basically.
Speaker A
Yeah. That's that's like the most intense roller coaster you could ever imagine. And that's so thinking about like being inside the car like when you crash test a car they have to like make sure that the roof of
Speaker A
the car can support the weight of the car. And that's in case of a rollover incident. So if the car rolls over and ends up on its roof, it can support the weight and not crush the driver.
Speaker A
Yeah. If this car can jump 20 ft in the air, that means it can fall 20 ft onto its roof, which is glass, right?
Speaker A
That's uh I don't even know. The above shot makes it look like the scissor doors or whatever. I don't even know. But like you'd never take the liability of having a driver in the car while that happens.
Speaker A
And then you think about like, okay, doing the flips and stuff. And the way it's described by the engineers and all the things that we we watched and the demos we watched were all autonomous as well with the flips and stuff. The more
Speaker A
you watch that, the more it seems like this is going to be a thing. Remember the Benny robot that we had, which does a little kick flip or whatever?
Speaker A
It's just a button that you press that can do the maneuver in the right environment and you don't really have any control over it while it's doing that maneuver and then it's over.
Speaker A
Yeah. and you did the party trick. I think that's what it's gonna end up being the more I see it.
Speaker A
I mean, if it ever gets made. Yeah, that's the other thing. But yeah, I mean and it's still crazy to see that. I don't think any I know it's going to sound like we're like absolutely poo pooing this thing and that's just because it's
Speaker A
burned us before, but like it was really I mean it's probably the craziest demo we've ever ever anyone's ever seen. Um, I mean, I actually was watching hockey and I just looked and saw all the Slack notifications going
Speaker A
crazy and you guys were losing. I was like, I have to see this. We're too busy beating the Rangers. But, um, it it was one of the craziest demos ever. It's just it's fine for it to be a crazy demo and
Speaker A
to realize that this is a car that was supposed to release almost 10 years ago that literally is just doesn't exist anymore. And now this is also 2 years 2028 when this quote comes out.
Speaker A
Yeah. Lots of unanswered questions because the event was basically like no information at all. But one of the bigger questions is okay. So for people who bought the other Roadster, they they literally I think Fron called it the
Speaker A
middle roadster which is funny because it never came out. But for people who like reserved that car, this is a completely different car.
Speaker A
Are they going to keep the reservation? Are you entitled to keep your reservation? What what trim does that get you? What are the prices of the different trims?
Speaker A
Yep. And that even had like the um the founders edition was like a special paint color that you paid more for.
Speaker A
So So what happened was with the Roadster we've only ever seen with with the middle roadster we've only ever seen red and white. And there's two reds though, weren't there?
Speaker A
Wasn't there red and founders red? I don't even know if it was a different red, but the Founder series was red and it was the first thousand off the production line. That's all it really got you. It was the highest end thing.
Speaker A
And then we started to see like random tweets about like SpaceX packages and we were like okay is the Founder series also going to include that stuff and it was like just wait this car is going to fly. We're like all right whatever. So,
Speaker A
now that we have all these new trims like base roadster, performance roadster, Thrust Roadster, Rocket Roadster, what happens to the people who put money down on the old car, what happens to people who put $250,000 down a decade ago on what they thought was
Speaker A
going to be a 600 mile four-seater and a Roadster, by the way, which means it has a removable roof. This one, I imagine they get the $250,000 Thrust version, maybe. I don't know.
Speaker A
That's Are those people going to get emails of like, "Choose your thing." How is, you know, the line going to work of who gets these things first? Like, are people back then, which I would think of now, if you're ordering the Roadster now
Speaker A
after that demo, you're potentially thousands of people late already from eight years ago who put their reservation in.
Speaker A
Yeah. Who's getting what? All unanswered. Yeah. What's coming out first? like having a limited version of the the rocket one has the best opportunity of like sell 10 of these in 2 years and then it launched but now the other ones
Speaker A
who knows when those are going to come out. Tesla loves to have their base cheaper versions, put the really expensive versions out for a while, and then you just never see a $35,000 Cybert truck. And and I think Marquez sent an image to the
Speaker A
Slack the other day. I assume from an agreement when you're signing up for the new Roadster that said, "You understand that the Roadster is still under development at the time you entered into this agreement. So, we cannot guarantee
Speaker A
when your vehicle will actually be delivered or if it will be delivered." Yeah. And to me, that told me all I need to know. Yeah. So, yeah. This uh to me is so we we see halo cars all the time. We see concept cars
Speaker A
all the time. This was just a demo whose target audience is not people who ever buy this car. That's the thing. Millions of people are going to see this. Almost none of them were were ever going to buy
Speaker A
this car. The target audience is people thinking about cars, thinking about Tesla, and it's to try to reposition Tesla in people's heads as a super high-tech company that has access to some technology that no other car company has. obviously with the SpaceX
Speaker A
collab and and then maybe they'll sell some of these and it kind of doesn't really matter. It makes no difference to Tesla if they actually sell them or not.
Speaker A
Mission has been accomplished already with the marketing stunt. That's all we can especially since they don't sell the Model S anymore.
Speaker A
Model S and X were cancelled because they didn't sell enough. Yeah. This by definition will not sell as much as those cars. So, you can imagine where it is in the priority list.
Speaker A
For sure. It's a halo. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it it happened. And then Porsche released another thing, too.
Speaker A
Is it Is it even a Halo? Really? When I say Halo, I mean like it's what they want people to think about when they think about the brand.
Speaker A
Yeah. Okay. It's It was the best marketing. It's not like other Halo cars though, where like you can buy them, you know?
Speaker A
Well, there's a lot of Halo That's the thing that's tricky is a lot of these crazy brands have halo cars that are essentially unbiable. Yeah.
Speaker A
You will never see one in the street. a McLaren W1. That's their new halo car.
Speaker A
We're never going to see one again. Yeah. Now, they'll make a thousand of them or whatever it is. And they will eventually, we assume, technically make all of these. A lot of them will sit in garages. They'll hit the track.
Speaker A
Sometimes they'll sit in collections and that's their halo car. But the cars they actually sell and move on volume are more important to the bottom line. But they don't move those cars unless they have the absolute apex. This is what
Speaker A
we're capable of. And here's a taste of the techn here's a taste of that technology in the car you're actually buying, right?
Speaker A
You'll never see the Ferrari F80 like Lamborghini, I'm sure, has some crazy thing that we can't buy. Porsches just announced a new thing which they will actually massproduce. But I was going to say to play devil's advocate, you know, you just named two
Speaker A
Halo cars that we will never see because they cost millions of dollars and they're made by manufacturers where all their cars are really expensive and super low quantity. And Tesla is not McLaren. They're not Ferrari, but they want the image of those
Speaker A
companies, but they're a mass production car company, right? So, if you're going to compare it to other Halo cars from mass production car companies like the Toyota Century, which is a super rare car, I've seen one on the road. The upcoming Lexus
Speaker A
LFR, we will see that on the road. We've seen Nissan GTRS like like these Halo cars are cars that like fundamentally exist and also push a lot of technological boundary.
Speaker A
Yeah. It's it's kind of like trying to shift their brand image. So like Nissan, Toyota, Honda, a lot of these companies, they're not necessarily selling performance cars to the masses based on the reputation as like winning LA or
Speaker A
like having the highest end best Formula 1 team. And if you want to move from being Tesla and selling uh, you know, an average like mass-produced EV to being able to eventually sell more or have this higher status image, you got to
Speaker A
kind of convince people you have that technology. Convince people you have some special sauce. And I guess connecting the dots to SpaceX is them trying to convince people they have that, which how else would they do it, I
Speaker A
guess. And that's the other thing. The end of the Hagerty video I think made a really good point. So, shout out to Henry Catchpole for making the point, which is so they they redesigned the Roadster, Roadster 2. It's red. I think
Speaker A
all of us agree that's like a prettier car, like a better looking car, just like a normal looking EV.
Speaker A
I thought it looked good. I get why they made like it looked really good then, but I think it's not as flashy. This is flashy.
Speaker A
Yeah. So, they announced that car. They show all the specs. They show all this range and all this performance and 0 to 60 in under two seconds, right? And then they go, "But it's coming out in four years, so wait a while." And then we
Speaker A
wait a while and a couple go years go by and we start to see that happen in other places. Like Lucid makes a 1.9 second 060 car. RMAC makes a 1.9 second 0 to 60 car. McMerry Spearing shows up, has the
Speaker A
fan car suction, and suddenly that Roadster isn't really like a Halo car anymore. like it's not really doing anything that we haven't seen before and it doesn't accomplish the mission of being that halo anymore.
Speaker A
That's fair. Yeah. And so at some point between that 2017 event and now Tesla decided never mind like we're not doing that. We need something else about Roadster to actually be a Halo again. And that's probably when we started seeing like
Speaker A
tweets about SpaceX and cold rocket thrusters and oh we have a better idea. and they just never communicated about like not ever shipping the thing that we all saw. But they now have a thing that is interesting again. I mean, you see
Speaker A
the clicks, you see the people talking about it like it is now moved to accomplishing some sort of Halo status even though it again probably doesn't ever have to ship. And it probably helps that it looks kind of like the
Speaker A
Cybertruck because nobody else is going to make a car that looks like the Cybertruck. So, if you stick to that similar design, it's not going to like it's not going to not hold up, right?
Speaker A
Like to your point, the Roadster they announced in 2017 looks amazing but looks like a car.
Speaker A
[laughter] Yeah. And there's so many cars that look like it now. At the time it it looked very advanced, but now it looks kind of just like a car.
Speaker A
Yeah. And so that nobody else is going to like make something that looks like it.
Speaker A
And I think realistically like normies are seeing this. Normies are not following Tesla closely. They're just like, "Oh, oh, he made this car. Great." And like they won't follow that it doesn't come out. They won't follow like they change it in 10 years. Like they
Speaker A
just see what it is now. And that's the impression that most people are getting.
Speaker A
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's so dude, how dare you? How dare you not think this will be out by next week.
Speaker A
I don't know what any of you are all haters. You don't love technology. I'm gonna I'm sure your Twitter has been an absolute mess for Twitter's been because Twitter is full of um there are so many people on Twitter who are have like a
Speaker A
vested interest in Tesla success who hear any criticism of kind of anything Tesla related as hate basically. So if I come along and say wow really cool demo I don't think it's going to ship though which is I think a reasonable thing to
Speaker A
say. They hear that as like, "What do you mean you don't believe in the vision?" And Elon has landed rockets and caught them before. Like, okay, we know all that, but like I don't think it's going to ship.
Speaker A
There's like a really hilarious tweet about like eight years ago Marquez was so amped about the Tesla Roadster and blah blah blah. What changed? And there's all these people who have been here since who have been like following Tesla for a
Speaker A
decade who are like, "You mean eight years ago when he spent $50,000? like 8 years ago when we all got promised this thing and it's still not out like Mhm.
Speaker A
they've been burned before. I feel like a lot of the new the new Tesla crowd is the post Elon buy Twitter crowd that's like a little more into it and didn't see the the beginning of where it all
Speaker A
also watch the video negative video. It's just a balanced thoughtful video. It's skepticism. It's okay to have skepticism.
Speaker A
People are just like it's just social media. people just pull out of context, make everything seem negative.
Speaker A
I think I have a lot of respect for the engineers at Tesla who get tasked with these impossible things and who also happen to make like some solid cars. And so the thing that changed from 8 years ago is Tesla was really different 8
Speaker A
years ago. They were like ramping up and making this new thing called Model 3 and then Model Y and these really like holy crap we can make like a kind of a cheap like EV that's actually pretty solid and like
Speaker A
really efficient too and like oh a front trunk that's a good idea. like they had lots of good ideas and were executing on it and then mispromise here, mispromise there, overpromise here. Now it's eight years of that later. It's like fool me
Speaker A
once. Like that's it's a different landscape. So that's why it feels different. I cannot stress enough I have something to say.
Speaker A
Okay. I just I have two things to say. I have seven things to say. [laughter] First of all, I just want to say I cannot stress enough how important it is. If you're even remotely curious about this car, that you watch the
Speaker A
entire 30 minute event in full, not clips. Because if you watch it in clips, it might come across like, "Wow, that's an exciting demo. Wow, that's an exciting demo." Like, look at that. If you watch the full 30 minutes, it
Speaker A
becomes so abundantly clear that there was zero preparation done in the actual presentation of this. almost every single thing they say is like so obviously either winged or there's a teleprompter. They're like, "Oh, we're doing this now. Oh, we're doing this
Speaker A
now." So, just like zero effort, which is insane to me. And then you'll see the end of the event, which is one of the most shocking things I've ever seen a corporation do on stage, even for Tesla, where it ends with the crowd yelling
Speaker A
questions at Elon. What's the range? What's the price? And Elon just goes, "Let's do a kickflip again." And then dips.
Speaker A
There's not even a sign off. It's like a watch this kick flip. I'm not answering any questions cuz this is not a real product.
Speaker A
But the last time people yelled questions at him, he answered a bunch of things which was really bad.
Speaker A
It's not getting nuanced. Well, it goes people talking about hardware versions with new autonomous things and he essentially was saying stuff that wasn't they weren't ready for and it was either telling people like their hardware might not actually work with full
Speaker A
self-driving. It was bad for them. Tesla has a they've had this for a while where they kind of have like a weird style of events like we think we watch a lot of polished tech events where they're extremely rehearsed and this is
Speaker A
their 50th time doing it or it's pre-recorded or whatever. But you watch car company events and they're a little different. They're a little more here's some music and we're going to roll out the car behind a smoke screen and the
Speaker A
cool headlights through the fog and stuff and like Tesla style is like we are talking to the nerds for a little bit. It kind of actually depends on who the target demographic is cuz if it's just like a stock pump type of event
Speaker A
where it's like look at this cool thing, our Halo product. They are all stock pump.
Speaker A
Well, when they're delivering a product, but think about the last like five Tesla events we've had to watch, dude. like they're all like, "Oh, we'll watch." Oh, it was nothing again.
Speaker A
Like Model 3 and Model Y, I remember those events where they felt the same in terms of like, what are we talking about next? Oh, here's the new slide. Like they had a lot of those moments, which was I think people found that almost uh
Speaker A
like refreshingly just here's the new thing. We're just being really straight up about it. But then they've not delivered. I mean, Cybertruck, so they rolled it out and then said it's coming out in a few years, so they didn't
Speaker A
really have to give a bunch of details. And then you start seeing that like fade where it's like people have questions again. How often do you see a tech event where the audience yells out questions and then the CEO answers them? Like that
Speaker A
just doesn't happen. So, it is kind of a weird vibe for events. I don't even think it's a style. I think to answer you and what you said of like you said Tesla didn't put any effort into this. I think Tesla puts a lot of
Speaker A
effort into it and there's a common denominator in both of your theories on it that one person screws that up and that's Elon's winging it up there. No.
Speaker A
No. Well, I think the perfect example is in the beginning and Lars got on that stage knowing full well they were pushing snake oil and were saying check out our cool just as culpable in this.
Speaker A
But right in the beginning of it there's a part where Elon just starts talking and the timer starts counting down for the demo he's about to do and they have to cut him off and be like hold on hold
Speaker A
on we're doing a demo cuz he's just completely winging. There's probably a teleprompter there for him and he's just not going off the teleprompter. because they all Tesla wants to be the Joe Rogan of car companies. They think they can
Speaker A
just like be cool, relatable bros like and we don't have to know anything. We'll just like get by on our like cool casual chill bro vibe when that's like not how it works when you're trying to like build products that millions of
Speaker A
people will have to use safely and abide by America's strict security laws. There's a I think there's a big difference between their like Model 3 event and their Halo product event where if you watch the Model 3 event, which I
Speaker A
I think I remember pretty clearly, like there were cheers for the spec announcements. They'd be like, "It's a, you know, 280 mi range and people went, "Wa, you can do that for this price?" And they had like this very logical,
Speaker A
sensible, like here's what you need to know about this car. Cuz they knew it was their mass-produced car and that's the audience for it. But for a product that is inherently lower audience, like people aren't really watching this,
Speaker A
thinking about buying it, then they don't give those details, and then they go way more over the top of like the fanfare and the look at this cool trick because that's for that target audience.
Speaker A
Right. Right. But there's also a world, again just playing devil's advocate here, where if you're doing a Halo car to be like, "Look at all this cool tech we have access to." You might want to, you know, express in kilton or like
Speaker A
pounds how much force your fan system can deliver instead of saying quote, "It can suck the chrome off a tailpipe." I think that was my biggest issue with the event was when I watched Lars and Fron in those three videos after the fact.
Speaker A
They did talk like that and they gave us like the 10,000 PSI carbon override pressure vessels and they told us the 1.3 the one megawatt of power, the 1300 horsepower from a rear wheel drive car.
Speaker A
And even to the journalist credits, like they were asking questions like, "So, why is it rear wheel drive?" And they would answer, "We think it's a better driver's experience. We're trying to save weight." and they would give like
Speaker A
we're hitting hopefully 1,700 kg with this car. All this technical information, none of which made it to the presentation because the target audience for the presentation is millions of millions of people who don't know what that means and won't make a
Speaker A
difference to them. I mean, or even because Elon's up there might be like, I think we could go a little faster than that. And now everything they've just said is null and they have to try and fix it.
Speaker A
Like, what do you think makes positions them better as a crazy tech rocket car company?
Speaker A
one uh 1,300 horsepower rear wheel drive smaller, higher density power unit connected to 115 kWh battery with double the cooling or look at this kickflip.
Speaker A
It'll also go half the speed of sound. Yeah. Like the snake oil that they say on stage, people love that. They eat it up. So that's what they do. Um, my last thought on this was this event feels like it all but confirms that the
Speaker A
Cyber Cap bet is totally safe because no one like we're not even like I mean I knew already but that is safe.
Speaker A
That is very safe. Cyber so much focus on this CyberCap can just do whatever it wants. Um, it will continue to be geofenced. It will probably roll out some more things in Austin and maybe taxi service is like a kind of a slowly
Speaker A
expanding thing but you are not going to buy a cyber cab this year. Sorry. I'll see you on the the life-size Hot Wheels track Marquez.
Speaker A
Yeah, that'll be the one place that someday cars will fly, allegedly. Hey, look, they can fly, but for only one second.
Speaker A
Yeah. So, well, I greatly anticipate uh a bunch of clips from this podcast getting clipped out of context.
Speaker A
Yes. None of us should go further for the next two weeks. Yeah, it's a good time.
Speaker A
I mean, evergreen, but word to all my haters in jail right now for pretty much exactly this. And we're just like whatever. Let's when you [laughter] look most annoyed in America. When you steal from investors, you go to prison. When you
Speaker A
steal from regular people, that's just a normal day at the office. Clip that. [laughter] We're going to hard pivot everybody.
Speaker A
Just like the roster when it does a barrel roll. Thank you. So cool. Okay. So, [laughter] Thanks.
Speaker A
Uh, taking a back uh to the duos, there have been many iconic duos throughout history. Steve Jobs, Steve Wniaak, keyboard and mouse. Peter, Simon and Garuncle, if that's your thing. But what iconic tech duo had a feature called knockknock?
Speaker A
Simmer on that. Well, I've used that. Where's that from? Have also Don't say it out loud.
Speaker A
Oh, what? Good phrasing. Good phrasing. That's a good question. I know this one. I can say it again if you need to hear it again.
Speaker A
Can you say it again? What iconic tech duo had a feature called knockknock? [laughter] Great, great, great question. It was phrased originally too easy, so we made it a little more ambiguous.
Speaker A
Perfect. I love that they're scratching their heads. This is great. All right. Well, I'm gonna get a trivia point later. We'll be right back.
Speaker A
[music] Support for the show comes from Jira by Atlassian. So AI is only as useful as the context it has to work from. But when that context is scattered across different tools, threads, and DMs, that means [music] your team and your AI
Speaker A
agents end up flying blind. That's the problem that Jira solves. What's the goal tied to your project? what got decided last week in Slack. Atlassian's teamwork graph pulls all of these pieces together from Jira, Confluence, Slack, GitHub, and more so nothing falls
Speaker A
through the cracks. With Jira, you can actually share that context with the AI agents you already [music] use like Claude, Cursor, and GitHub Copilot.
Speaker A
Assign them work directly or connect your agents through MCP. Spend less time digging through endless links and DMs, less time chasing down what got decided and by who, and more time actually shipping. Learn more at jira.com. That's j I A.com.
Speaker A
All right, welcome back. Uh, I was kind of joking, but not really joking. I actually do want to briefly talk about Porsche's car event that happened the same day as Tesla's car event.
Speaker A
It was the same day. It was the same day. Oh, wow. Which is really funny. Um, so Porsche also announced a concept car. See if you can spot the similarities and the differences between Porsche style announcing a concept car and what we
Speaker A
just talked about for the last, I don't know, hour of Tesla announcing a concept car. Okay.
Speaker A
Big difference. I heard of the Roadster. Well, okay. So, Porsche, just for a little bit of background, they do mass-produce cars, but it's funny, they are very much a sports car company that also happens to sell crossovers like the
Speaker A
Macan and the Cayenne, like a family SUV type of thing in much more volume, which specifically allows them the money to develop better sports cars. Does that make sense? As like a business model. So people know Porsche as the sports car
Speaker A
company even though most of their sales are actually not sports cars. Okay. So for the longest time, very very long time, they have only made really two sports cars, which is the Cayman and the 911. You've probably heard about
Speaker A
these cars. The Cayman is their sort of entry levelish mid-range sports car. It's very small. We had one like a GT4 a while ago. I don't know if you saw it.
Speaker A
And then the 911, which is like their halo, highest end sports car. They also have made extremely high-end Halo products with crazy technologies that you can kind of never really buy but a few people could buy like the 918 Spider
Speaker A
or the Carrera GT kind of legendary cars. A lot of words for sure. So I mean that again following 918 Spider 1000 horsepower hybrid convertible like super limited edition $2 million car. Okay.
Speaker A
You've probably never seen one. Correct. But oh my god, what a car. [snorts] Okay, so that means that the highest end mass-produced car that they've made for all this time has been the 911, which is a rear engine car. And they've made a
Speaker A
bunch of variants of the 911. They've made this lightweight rear wheel drive version. I'm oversimplifying car people.
Speaker A
Please have mercy. But they have an all-wheel drive hybrid version. They have a bunch in between. And they sort of range between like a $100,000 new and like $300,000 new cuz they're high-end sports cars.
Speaker A
Yeah. So, what Porsche just introduced is a car to compete with what a lot of the other high-end brands like Ferrari and Lamborghini have been putting out lately, which is this like $600,000 range of car.
Speaker A
Oh. Which has, you know, hybrid systems and way more power and all this stuff. And like they haven't really been competing because the 911 is the highest end car that they've mass-produced. So, it's the Mission S. It is a new design which has
Speaker A
a lot of like hidden cues of like the greatest hits of their old designs. It is mid-enine and they announced no specs at all. They simply showed the design of the concept car. The outside they open the doors. They showed you the inside.
Speaker A
Very few screens. They have a MagSafe mount for a phone. Um but these really cool seats. This harness seat and it's midenine. It's got quad tail pipes.
Speaker A
These really cool headlights and DRLs. The back kind of has Luch vibes of this like carvy.
Speaker A
It's like a curved on the outside and then another curve on the 100%. Believe it or not, that's referential to another older Porsche that kind of had the same look and had some racing success. So that's like a nice touch for historians.
Speaker A
But I agree. But it looks like the wing comes up and then it doesn't look like that. But when the wing's down.
Speaker A
Yeah. Yeah. So they announce this car, they show it off. They do not announce a price. They do not announce the engine. They do not announce the performance. They just said, "Here's the car. It's going to come out later. Trust me." And that's
Speaker A
it. Can I ask a question? Yeah. Are Porsche fans like really mad at that?
Speaker A
Porsche fans are mostly loving this car. Really? Yes. I was going to say the difference here is I would assume most Porsche fans and like car enthusiasts would be really pissed off that there's not a lot of specs in that. And the difference is
Speaker A
that I assumed they would be mad, whereas the Tesla fans were like, "Fair enough.
Speaker A
It did a kick flip. That's cool." Yeah. So Porsche has a reputation for making really good cars. So there is an expectation that Porsche will eventually deliver what they're showing us and that it will be really good. So I think
Speaker A
people give them the benefit of the doubt in a lot of ways. Um there's a lot of speculation of like, oh, there's a fan on the top and this is probably cooling like a flat 8 instead of a flat
Speaker A
6. Oh, it's probably going to sound really good. It looks like it has a high like we're looking into a lot of things.
Speaker A
Thinking about what they might do. What's a flat 8 and a flat 6? Um that's the number of cylinders in and it affects the sound characteristics of the car a lot as well.
Speaker A
So that's what the big hole in the top of the car is for. The big hole in the top of the car. You see the fan? That's where the guy sits.
Speaker A
[laughter] There's a fan on the back of the car. If you go to the back No, that's um Oh, the front of the car you're looking at is uh don't know what it is.
Speaker A
Scoop on the roof. There's a Yeah, there's a hood scoop on the roof which just sucks in cold air from the front to cool the engine in the middle of the car.
Speaker A
But he's talking about see back here there's like a fan. No, I was talking about the hood scoop.
Speaker A
Yeah, the hood scoop is cool. We love a hood scoop. The back of the car has a fan. We love that. But anyway, a lot of the praise from Tesla from Porsche fans is about the design decisions. Like they
Speaker A
have this metal key that actually sticks into the car and turns which they got rid of in the 911. They have a lot of things like So wait, so it's a key?
Speaker A
Well, it's not like shaped like a key. It's the key fob. The key is like just described a regular key.
Speaker A
I I realize what I'm doing. I realize what I'm doing. This metal thing that goes and you turn it and it I am literally describing a key, but it's like the key fob has a place in the car where it sits.
Speaker A
Yeah. And obviously connects to the car and lets you It's like not quite push to start, but it sits in the car and the car knows that you're in it. You can turn it on, but you also turn it on by
Speaker A
turning it. So, it's effectively a key. Can you also turn it without that? It's a It's a key in reverse almost.
Speaker A
It's like what? Yeah. Yeah, it's like a negative key. It it No, look at it. It kind of isber has a slot on it. It's got the key part.
Speaker A
It's the key chamber indented. Yeah, it's a portable key chamber. But like they also did the thing. So in the 911, they famously in this recent generation got rid of the beautiful like analog tachometer with the real needles
Speaker A
and it's just screens. Now in this mission S, we're back to real physical gauges that like move out and separate and like have these beautiful lights behind them.
Speaker A
Super super intricate stuff. And the biggest complaint I've seen really is that oh gosh, Porsche is making all the stuff we love, but in the $600,000 car instead of the 911.
Speaker A
It's not accessible. But generally, a lot of good vibes around this car, which has no specs, no price, no performance claims, no release date. It's just here's the concept, you love it, don't you?
Speaker A
And so people are not mad about that. Not really. It sounds like people are just happy they're getting the things back that they used to like before that Porsche took away from them.
Speaker A
Yeah. Well, here's my other question is if it's a concept car, don't most car manufacturers show off concept cars and then never make them?
Speaker A
Yeah. So, I think there's different levels of that. I think there's like the CES concept car, which is like here's a thing that is really legitimately just a concept that we could make, but we don't plan on it. And then there's here's the
Speaker A
name of the model. Here's all the stuff that we've developed. It's going to come out. Like so the Tyan before it came out was the Porsche Mission E concept.
Speaker A
Oh. And it had like these cool wheels and it was their electric concept car and then a year or two later they ship it and it's slightly modified but it's the Tyan. Got it.
Speaker A
It's close. So that's like a different level of concept like they're going to make the thing.
Speaker A
Okay. So not like the Hyundai um the N7 Yeah. N74. That one I got the vibe was going to get made but then there was too many questions.
Speaker A
Will and then they say it won't. I felt like it went back and forth like this isn't getting made and then everyone talked about it was like oh no maybe it won't they like switched their drivetrain claims it was going to be like a hybrid
Speaker A
and then they had something about uh generator I don't remember what they're going to do it was yeah I don't it was like gas or something or hydrogen nitrogen yeah something weird anyway that doesn't you can't buy that yet obviously
Speaker A
so yeah I don't know similar to Tesla no real information on the car other than a design on stage and some cool tricks like gauges that move. It's not a kick flip but I was going to say [laughter]
Speaker A
it's a cool. This is like ours flies. Different target demographic. We reinvented the key.
Speaker A
Very different target demographic. Like this one has like a very uh like an analog looking shifter. It's not a manual car, but it does have this sweet looking like gear shifter.
Speaker A
Totally different target demo. But it's not, to be clear, a halo car. It's a mass-produced car above the 911.
Speaker A
And they will still have crazy halo cars. Yeah. I guess my question is, are they taking your money for this now?
Speaker A
Not yet. Yeah. Okay. Not yet. It's not a warthog. It's a uh Yeah. To be that's a big difference.
Speaker A
Tesla's taking your money right now. Porsche is not announcing a price or taking your money right now.
Speaker A
Tesla been taking your money for eight years. Yeah. So, I assume when you're closer to real mass production, Porsche will announce a price. They will start whatever allocation process they have and people will start to try to buy this
Speaker A
thing. Yeah. I won't. I like it a lot. I want one. [laughter] I want to leave. I just want to sit in it. It looks so good.
Speaker A
Yeah. Does it? Yeah. I feel like the white kind of like it. They do this thing with their concept cars where they make them in white and they give them like white wheels and it's a little much for me. I would never
Speaker A
get it in that color. But some of the other renders I've seen in other colors.
Speaker A
My biggest gripe is the door looks like just like it doesn't match the rest of the car.
Speaker A
Interesting. Right. Like it has this nice hard line and then the door happens and it goes away and it's this like shadow and then the line comes back on the back panel.
Speaker A
Interesting. Yeah, it would have been cool if they kept the line through the whole car.
Speaker A
Yeah. Sorry I ruined it for you. Yeah, never mind. I don't like that anymore. [laughter] I don't want to play with you anymore.
Speaker A
Okay. But yeah, that happened the same day and obviously was overshadowed on uh social media by the one that flipped over upside down.
Speaker A
You know, under promise, overd deliver. We'll say that forever. I have a feeling both of these are overpromising.
Speaker A
Well, Porsche is not really promising anything. Yeah. Just that it might look like that.
Speaker A
Pretty much fair. Mid engine. Not that it goes half the speed of sound. Yeah.
Speaker A
The only real promise that gets people going is it lives above the 911. And like the 911 is a really high-end car.
Speaker A
The Roadster lives above the 911 when it's doing a flying through the air. Yeah. Anyway, that's all. That's my uh that's my brief car's corner.
Speaker A
But you know what is 100% real confirmed. You can have it right now. Oh, and I won't even take a single scent from you.
Speaker A
My trivia point. You're Oh, yeah. There you go. Also, everyone, I see you tweeting at me that people have figured out how to get developer access into web OS TVs and are building their own uh little things. That's
Speaker A
awesome. Uh I'm working I'm doing it a different way at home. I'll talk about it on a future episode, but I do see that this exists.
Speaker A
Um and same with Android TVs. I saw this morning that people were uh vibe coding their own TV UIs and someone made a Wii one.
Speaker A
Yeah. Oh, send me that. I got I want to see that. It's pretty interesting. And I think I won't talk about it too long. I think the thing that a lot of people are realizing is the way you do it. It's a
Speaker A
little bit easier on Android TV than We OS is that you essentially give yourself developer access over Wi-Fi so that you can hit the console from a separate machine.
Speaker A
And I think a lot of people asked Claude like, "Hey, get into my TV and let me do this." And then Claw did it and they were like, "Wait, you can get in dev mode to my TV just by being on the same
Speaker A
Wi-Fi network." [laughter] Anyway, it's a little more complicated. There's some other stuff like that. We also didn't get to talk about the crazy the the the certificate issuing company in India.
Speaker A
For all my ICAN nerds that watched our seven secret history keys internet episode, uh there was a really crazy piece of security key news that hit the internet yesterday.
Speaker A
Wait, really? Um, yeah, the TLDDR, like I know we got to do trivia and wrap up this episode. The TLDDR is like, you know how there are those certificate issuing uh companies that generate like giant numbers and then when you do your
Speaker A
HTTPS, it confirms that number and then you get the the lock and you know you're actually on the site that the DNS promised.
Speaker A
A bunch of keys got leaked from a major one of those certificate issuers in India. Oh, one of the keys, uh, so the numbers are supposed to be like 100 digits long in S and like 300 digits long in binary, something like that.
Speaker A
Um, one of the, uh, one of the keys was four. Uh, not four digits.
Speaker A
Just the just the number four. Are you what? Yes. What? Incredible. Anyway, guys, there are 71 Google apps listed on the iOS App Store.
Speaker A
Oh, shoot. You need to write down one and whoever's app is the least updated, least recently updated gets the point.
Speaker A
[music] I'm kind of not sure if this is real. Oh, we also didn't get to talk about the PHP vulnerability.
Speaker A
Uh, [music] the drug. No, it's a it's a coding language. PHP. You need to cut that.
Speaker A
I don't know. I don't know [laughter] how we got around that. It's fine. The existence in the existence of things is not promotion.
Speaker A
So, you read me an app and I will just when it was last updated.
Speaker A
When it was last updated is about to die, so we got to we got to we got to run it. All right.
Speaker A
Who wants to Is that an app? That's a really good one. Uh, someone give me one.
Speaker A
I wrote Google Slides. Google Slides. I just don't know anyone who has ever used it. I feel like I like thought do I just go save and make sure I pick something that I'm right that like is real.
Speaker A
I almost wrote keep. You know what it is? Business software. I almost wrote keep.
Speaker A
Was it updated yesterday? Google Slides was in fact updated yesterday. Yeah, I kind of wanted to do a one what was the most recent and I would have guessed Google Play.
Speaker A
Uh business software gets updated every day. No, Google Play was not one of the most recent. Uh Andrew put Google Duo.
Speaker A
Google Duo is not even on the app store anymore. Is it not even on the app store anymore?
Speaker A
Which is why they deleted it though? So you are I was hoping they just forgot to delete. I was going to put inbox by Google. It's really gone. It's Whoa. Didn't it get merged into Google Meet?
Speaker A
Merged into Google Meet. I don't even remember. Mine might not be there cuz Fi exists now.
Speaker A
No. No. FI is different from Fiber. They didn't merge them. No, they did not.
Speaker A
Okay. Maybe. So Marz, you put I put Google Fiber cuz I I don't know if there's an app for it.
Speaker A
There almost definitely is an app for it. If there is an app for it, it means you win because Yeah, cuz I was one day and Andrew was null. Well, I also guessed Google or Duo cuz I was like, "Oh, is that what he
Speaker A
thinking?" Alo is a separate now, I think, and it's gone too. Alo was Yeah, Alo is also gone.
Speaker A
And Duo lasted longer than Aloe. Aloe was like their Hangouts like replacement. And oh, Hangouts probably been a minute.
Speaker A
Hangouts does not exist. Got merged into that's so I thought if they had 71 apps, there's probably some vestigial apps that just sit around before they That was my guess. I was hoping that maybe it was there for like some stupid
Speaker A
reason. Well, I was going to say uh inbox by Google, but I don't think that exists anymore.
Speaker A
Can I search? They closed it down a long time ago, but I don't think it's on the App Store anymore.
Speaker A
I need So, I want to search. And are we talking about updated on the iOS app store?
Speaker A
On the iOS app store? iOS app store? Yes, specifically. Here's the here's this is tricky.
Speaker A
There is an app called Giber. Oh, that's not Google. Yeah. And it is made by a company called Google Fiber, Inc., but it's not the same developer account as the rest of the Google app. So, I'm I can't really
Speaker A
tell if this is I don't think this is Google. Can I see this? Can you link us this list?
Speaker A
I'll take the L. Does that Does that mean you win with an app that was updated yesterday? [laughter] That's what I was saying. We should have just picked one. Let's go.
Speaker A
That's brutal. Damn. We should have both said keep. Oh, keep it. I I crossed it out. I thought that would be updated like this year. It was this year for sure, but not yesterday.
Speaker A
I mean, a year within a year is one oldest. The three oldest. Number three, Photo Scan by Google Photos.
Speaker A
Oh yeah, that was a separate app. It still is a separate app. November 21st, 2022. It's still on the app store.
Speaker A
Oh my god, it is still really good. And number two, the Gboard app. What?
Speaker A
Yeah. Hasn't been I was going to try it on the Duo actually. Oh, maybe on the iPhone. I bet you Gboard on Android's gotten updated a thousand times.
Speaker A
On iPhone, it was last updated May of 2022. That's crazy. And the [clears throat] least recently updated app by Google on iOS is Google Cloud Search, last updated November 6th, 2019. I have no idea what that app does.
Speaker A
Neither do they. Neither do they. [laughter] Everyone who worked on that has left the company. I guarantee you.
Speaker A
So, David, congratulations on your point. I'm going to give a quick update. It's like a participation award.
Speaker A
[laughter] That's literally what I got. That is painful. It's a It's a strategy. I really wish I had done the I make stuff up question now. I'm really I'm sorry, guys. I feel like Can I just name a couple apps that I
Speaker A
didn't know were apps that Google has? Recapture is an app for some reason. Wait, I've seen that logo a thousand times.
Speaker A
I guess it's an app that Google makes. Um Fitbit Ace. It's another Fitbit app.
Speaker A
Just an app for one of the Fitbits. Oh my god. There's an app for Fitbit Ace. Oh, is that like for kids, which now Google owns?
Speaker A
I guess so. Own Fitbit. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Uh Google Fi Wireless is still here. Uh Google Tasks would have been a good guess.
Speaker A
Google Opinion Rewards separate app. No way. Yeah. Wait, when did that get updated? What do you do it in?
Speaker A
I don't know. It's in there. I have that as a separate app. I have that as a separate app. You're right. It is a separate app.
Speaker A
Google Arts and Culture. They arts and culture is great. I I use that. All right. Shout out to museums. My favorite opinion rewards thing is you'll get a question that's like, "Have you been to any of these places recently and
Speaker A
it's like seven things and one that you literally just left like I just got home from the grocery store." It's like, "Have you been to um like Chipotle or LLBAN or the Shop, right? I know you were just at and you're like there's
Speaker A
like, oh, when did you go? The last month? The last week?" Have you gotten the ones where it shows you a screenshot of a Google search you did?
Speaker A
Yeah. And you're like, "You took that?" Yeah. Well, and but every time I do that, then you press back to look at the other one and it disappears from No. My favorite thing is every week I get one that says, "Were you born in New
Speaker A
Mexico?" And I say, "No." And then it gives me a quarter and it does it over and over again.
Speaker A
Infinite money glitch. It's infinite money glitch. Um guys, so not much to update on the score. David, congratulations on your 17th point. Marquez and Andrew, you're just behind. It's not even worth it.
Speaker A
Incredible. Don't worry about it. It's not even worth [laughter] talking about yourself, right? It's your turn.
Speaker A
Wow. Okay. Pity point party. Okay. So, my question for you is, what iconic tech duo had a feature called knock?
Speaker A
My supposed to say who's there? Oh, who's there? Um, entire guess is based off of Marquez saying nice phrasing.
Speaker A
God, I really remember I really remember the name of the feature, but I really don't.
Speaker A
The feature is named Knockk Knockock, isn't it? It's an icon. Yeah, I just repack a duo.
Speaker A
[music] I hope I get this right cuz you guys gave too many hints, but I'm probably just wrong.
Speaker A
I'm so close. It was like I know this, David. You know it. Well, do I know?
Speaker A
I hope I'm right. I want to see yours first. Oh, never mind. Flip them around.
Speaker A
Flip them around. Okay. Okay. [laughter] Wow. So, wow. That is an iconic mine first cuz I am wrong.
Speaker A
I really thought you guys had this one. I wrote lingo like duol lingo and I thought maybe there was a like learn how to say hello in different languages by knocking.
Speaker A
That's a good thought. That's a good innocent guess. David, what did you say? I wrote the Surface Duo, but I don't Yeah, I think there So, I wrote this. There's like an LG phone that had like a case
Speaker A
that had a second screen on it and you could like knock on the outside and it would show it would light up and show you.
Speaker A
Talking about the dot matrix case. No, that's HTC. There's LG had like a case that you could knock on the outside, it would show you the inside. I don't know if it was called Duo, but it seems like it would because it has a
Speaker A
second screen. So, like maybe that. I guess not. So, I really wanted to give you an easy question. I was really trying to get y'all some points this week.
Speaker A
Oh, and it better not be iPhone. We went too hard. Definitely not. Um, does anyone have a sec a backup?
Speaker A
I'm just Is the feature to turn Oh, no. That was like the I was thinking of like the tap tap to turn on the flashlight.
Speaker A
Can you read the question one more time? What iconic tech duo chop had a feature called knockknock? Do you want another hint?
Speaker A
Yeah. Can you tell us what the feature does? I don't know. [laughter] It would It would give it away. Give it away.
Speaker A
I would take a little give you another hint. It's just going to tell them what that is. Can I just Why don't we just give We can give you just a different question.
Speaker A
Why don't No, I want to know what this is. What if you just give the hint and it's first person who answers?
Speaker A
Okay. If I say this was an iconic popular video conferencing platform, Google Duo. Oh well, yeah.
Speaker A
That's so funny that I almost I GOT IT RIGHT ON MY FIRST QUESTION. [laughter] I was going to Yes.
Speaker A
I was like, he knows. He's looking at me. He knows. I remember what it was. What it was was that if you started video calling the other person, they would see your feed on their screen before they answered.
Speaker A
Yes, David. That's what it was. This is tech trivia in action. So, it's like what FaceTime does now, right?
Speaker A
No, FaceTime does not show like if I FaceTime you, you do not see my face.
Speaker A
So, the way it would work is like if we had two Pixel phones or whatever or anything with Duo, I would call you on Duo and I would be like, "Andrew, Andrew, what's up, Andrew?" But I wouldn't see
Speaker A
you. You would only see me. Yeah. Yeah. So, it was like a oneway. Before you answered, you got to decide whether or not you wanted to answer.
Speaker A
I'm sure no one ever abused that feature. [laughter] That's a crazy feature. You're in a meeting. And anyway, um, okay. I'm I'm [laughter] taking control of this. The trivia's gotten out of control. We got to return to our roots.
Speaker A
We're doing one more question. I know it's a long podcast. Stick with us. I need a point so bad.
Speaker A
We just got to We have to take it back, y'all. All right. One new story we did. Bam. One, one news story we did not talk about this week were the discovered vulnerabilities in the programming language PHP. You don't
Speaker A
need to know what PHP is to answer this question. Um, PHP, excuse me, the PHP vulnerabilities affect lots of services such as Dupal, Fininky, Joomla, and Magneto. Excuse me, Magneto.
Speaker A
Magento. Oh, which one of those is not a real CMS platform? Say them all again.
Speaker A
[music] Drupal. Mhm. [clears throat] Thinky, Magento, and Jumla. [music] [snorts] That is Drupal, Fininky, Magento [music] and Jumla.
Speaker A
Jumla. J [snorts] O M L A. They are all CMS platforms. Like Jude Law, like the actor Please.
Speaker A
Can I get this one? Okay. Uh, unfortunately, Marquez, Drupal is a CMS platform. Oh, no. Sorry, David, you are corrected as a CMS platform. Marquez, you you are wrong.
Speaker A
Yeah. Oh, wait. But is David right when he says? Uh, you're both right when you say is not a real thing. I made up. Uh, unfortunately, this does almost nothing to the Delta, meaning this was a waste of time.
Speaker A
No, I'm further from Marquez. Yeah, closer to Marquez. Yeah. And I'm also farther away from [laughter] um Yeah. You know what's weird is that a lot of CMS platforms have a lot of like double O's and U's in them
Speaker A
or no vowels at all. Well, yeah. Well, no. Well, that's just most tech products.
Speaker A
I was trying to give you a point, brother. I was really trying. I I should have got that right.
Speaker A
It's all good. Read us out. This podcast has gone on way too long as it is.
Speaker A
And Ellis is hungry and wants lunch. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. [laughter] Whoa, whoa, whoa. Who said that?
Speaker A
You putting words in his mouth? Yeah. Well, thanks, thanks for watching. Thanks for listening. Of course, we will have much more. Techtober is literally only halfway over. It's insane. Uh, we have much more coming. There's literally events next week. It's going to happen.
Speaker A
So, stay tuned. Get subscribed. See you then. Thanks for watching. Magma Goldra. Bye. Waveform is produced by Maria Zenel Roven, part of Fox Media Podcast Network, and intro. Music was created by VIL.
Speaker A
Bing duo. Oh, [music]
Topics:iPhone Duofoldable iPhoneTesla RoadsterPorsche Mission XSamsung notificationsapp optimizationSlackGmailtech podcastsmartphone review
![[YBA] frosti — Transcript](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/KAH0o3xSL3w/maxresdefault.jpg)
