[DD] Recorded back when Mur still had a Gallbladder

[Music] Ditch diggers, and ain't no one here with some not-so-nice advice for your writing career. To be clear, no punches will be pulled, but the punch may be spiked. How they like before they get on the mic. To my left, we got the mighty Merl Afi, and if I piss her off, believe me, she'll come after me. And her co-host Ursula Vernon on the right. Yes, she's furniture. Recite a slime mold speech tonight, so settle it folks. Buckle in, boot up, time to meddle in a way to make you WR or shut up. It's hard work, but the perk is that it is fun and exciting. Facebook will still be there when you're done writing. Ditch [Music] diggers. Ditch diggers coming to you live from the secret room behind the Ditch Diggers Manor Wine Cellar that's connected via tunnel. It is the Ditch Diggers with Merl Afi and Ursula Vernon. How are you, Ursula? I am pretty damn good. How are you, Merl? I am fairly good. I'm getting ready to have surgery later this week, but for now, I'm doing fine. Oh, well, yeah, that's a weird headspace to be in. It is. It really is. It's a, it's also one of those things where it's minor surgery. Many people have had it. On the other hand, I am going under general anesthesia, and I'm going to be intubated, and that all freaks me out just a little bit. So, um, yeah, no matter what happens, there's always that little tiny voice going, but what if you die on the table? Yeah, you haven't handed in the last book? Yeah, yeah, no, I did. I have handed in the last book. What if I don't get to edit it anymore to make it any better? I assume your editor will handle that. I'm probably, I'm probably too, I'm gonna have to put something in my will to have you finish it or something. Oh God, yeah, you want that? It'll get a little strange. I'll do it. Yeah, because we're friends. Yeah, thank you, thank you. Um, but yeah, we are, uh, this is the third episode of Ditch Diggers. We're hitting some sort of stride. I've been rather mind-blown with travel and kid illness and dog illness and all kinds of crap, but, um, um, now I'm fin upcoming surgery and yeah, and now upcoming surgery, but, but I'm able to record and do this thing, and hopefully by the time the surgery comes, I'll have this and other two episodes scheduled and, and, and edited and ready to go. But we are here to talk about writing as a job. For me, as I mentioned, sharing in my book, finally freed up some time to catch up on the many, many podcasts I'm behind on, so I haven't been writing at all. I've been, uh, doing the podcasty thing and thinking about my, uh, interactive fiction class, which I need to do some homework for. So that's what I've been up to. What about you, Ursula? Uh, I have been head down on this manuscript, and it is hitting the sort of rock rolling downhill, finally the point where you stop pushing and start chasing, and, uh, uh, it's, uh, uh, so I think I may finish it off this week, which would be great because then I go to Finland next week. So, uh, uh, it would be awesome if I could like not have this anywhere on my brain and just send it to my editor. Yeah, before I go, and then I'd be like, I am free for a week to do nothing but be at a convention and go to the museum and do yes, they're very big, very big on that in Finland, I know. Um, so yeah, luckily, if you hadn't noticed, the episode title is, um, WTF is wrong with people? Oh wait, we're Stitch Shakers. I can say it. What the [ __ ] is wrong with people? And our goal here is to make you not like people because people keep being stupid in public and on the internet, and, uh, we don't want you to be like people. So, um, as R mentioned, talking crap about people, we in the, uh, Discord people have been talking about, apparently, there's an agent who has been saying really stupid stuff, really, really stupid stuff on the internet, and you'd think I would have this queued up, but, uh, I, I mean, and let's be clear, people saying stupid things on the internet is, uh, uh, is Tuesday, yeah, and Wednesday and Thursday and every other day. But yes, when it's an agent who is a position with perhaps, uh, outsized clout in the writer community online or, uh, at least certainly among people trying to get, uh, uh, early in their careers, yeah, it's, uh, yeah, somebody's going to listen to this person and somehow miss the firestorm of the internet coming down on her with a big hammer and think, oh, this is the way things are. And so, uh, anyway, an agent has said, um, just read a query that was essentially The Road meets Deliverance, and yeah, and now I want someone to write this for me, please. And someone replies, not the original querier, and she said, hi, no, the author did not pitch it such, or, and the, uh, sample wasn't strong enough. And this is not the only thing that this person has said, but, um, I, you don't do that. No, you don't. You don't really. And if you do, you don't phrase it like that because sometimes, sometimes agents say, I'm looking for a YA, well, like a YA Deliverance or, uh, a vampire Presumed Innocent, or, you know, they'll come up with something that's kind of strangely specific that they want to see. And if it's, and you can, you can say that. It is fine to say that. You don't have to add because some another because an author pitched that to me and they weren't good enough to write it themselves. That's where you have crossed the line into just being horrible. Yeah, and the thing is, uh, ideas are not copyrightable. If, uh, one thing that's awesome in our little writing workshop we have twice a month, uh, on the Patreon where, where we, it's called Kick in the Pants because all you have to do is write a thousand words or 30 minutes on a prompt, and we always get very different pieces of fiction from the same prompt, but still, it's just, it's just the whole like decorum. You don't say, hey, I've just dumped my agent, this person who is at this address, and I'm going to tag them on social media and say they were awful and they owe me money. It's like no, you don't. You just don't do that. Um, and then someone else found, I mean, if they owed you money, I, uh, uh, I would forgive some lapses, but, uh, actually it's going to depend on the sum of money over time. Yeah, well, it's also there's an equation that would probably work it out, but okay, we'll have, we'll have to, there probably is something math out there that will tell us at what point do you name and shame. But I think most of us are of the opinion that you don't do that. I mean, even people who've told me that they want to leave an agent, they'll tell me like the download, like at cons looking to the side to make sure no one else can hear, and we'll say, I'm thinking of leaving my agent. Can you tell me about X, Y, or Z who I should talk to? But it's like I know very few people who would do that. Um, because, you know, it's a professional relationship, and even if you don't feel you've been professional, when they go low, you go lower is never a good look. So this agent has also, um, apparently said that she's a writer. Okay, the last thing I want is a writer claiming I consciously or subconsciously stole their book idea from myself. As a human, I cannot control what sticks in my back brain and what might at some point, whether in an image or a character name or a plot point or line of dialogue, come out again. I read so many things over the course of a day, week, month, year. I have no idea what I'll retain and what I won't. The good thing is I have no time to deviously sit here and plagiarize something outright. The bad thing is I read so much that certain ideas are bound to stick. How do I avoid these ideas emerging in my own writing? I don't know, but I urge squeamish litigious writers not to query me. I trust and respect writers and want the same courtesy in return. Okay, if a writer is reluctant to show me their work or legitimately thinks I'll steal it, which you just said you might do, I can't be bothered with them. There are lots of other talented writers and worthwhile projects out there. I mean, this is one of those weird things where it's not necessarily that she's wrong, but you shouldn't have said it. Yeah, exactly, like because yes, ideas do come from everywhere, and we are all like subconsciously.

on the mic to my left we got the mighty Mery and if I piss her off believe me she'll come after me and her co-host Ursa ver on the right yes she's Furniture recite a slime mold speech tonight so settle it folks Buckle in it

boot up time to medle in a way to make you WR or shut up it's hard work but the perk is that is fun and exciting Facebook will still be there when you're done writing ditch [Music] diggers ditch

diggers coming to you live from the secret room behind the ditch diggers Manor Wine Celler that's connected via tunnel it is the ditch diggers with Merl afy and Ursula Vernon how are you Ursula I am pretty damn good how are you myr I

am fairly good I'm getting ready to have surgery later this week but for now I'm doing fine oh well yeah that's a weird heads space to it is it really is it's a uh it's also one of those things where

it's it's it's minor surgery many people have had it on the other hand I am going under general anesthesia and I'm going to be intubated and that all freaks me out just a little bit so um yeah no

matter what happens there's always that little tiny voice going but what if you die on the table Yeah you haven't handed in the last book yeah yeah no I did I have handed in the last book what if I don't get to edit it anymore to

make it any better I assume your editor will handle that I'm probably I'm probably to I'm I'm GNA have to put something in my will to have you finish it or something oh God yeah you want that it'll get a

little strange I'll do it yeah because we're friends yeah thank you thank you um but yeah we are uh this is the third episode of ditch diggers we're we're hitting some sort of stride I've been rather mind blown with with travel and

kid illness and dog illness and all kinds of crap but um um now I'm fin upcoming surgery and yeah and now upcoming surgery but but I'm able to record and do this thing and hopefully by the time the surgery comes

I'll have this and other two episodes scheduled and and and edited and ready to go but we are here to talk about writing as a job for me as I mentioned sharing in my book finally freed up some

time to catch up on the many many podcasts I'm behind on so I haven't been writing at all I've been uh doing the podcasty thing and thinking about my uh interactive fiction class which I need to do some homework for so that's what

I've been up to what about you Ursula uh I have been head down on this manuscript and it is hitting the sort of rock rolling downhill finally the point where you stop pushing and start chasing and uh uh it's uh uh so I think I may

finish it off this this week which would be great because then I go to Finland next week so uh uh it's uh it would be awesome if I could like not have this anywhere on my brain and just

send it to my editor yeah before I go and then I'd be like I am free for a week to do nothing but be at a convention and go to the m Museum and do yes they're very big very big on that

in in fin I know um so yeah luckily if you hadn't noticed the episode title is um WTF is wrong with people oh wait we're Stitch shakers I can say it what the [ __ ] is wrong with people and our

goal here is to make you not like people because people keep being stupid in public and on the internet and uh we don't want you to be like people so um as R mentioned talking crap about people we in the uh Discord people have

been talking about apparently there's an agent who has been say really stupid stuff really really stupid stuff on the internet and you'd think I would have this queued up but uh I I mean and let let's be clear people

saying stupid things on the Internet is uh uh is Tuesday yeah and Wednesday and Thursday and every other day but yes when it's an agent who is a position with perhaps uh outsized clout in the writer Community online or uh at least

certainly among people trying to get uh uh early in their careers yeah it's uh yeah somebody's going to listen to this person and somehow Miss The Firestorm of the internet coming down on her with a big hammer and think oh this is the way

things are and so uh anyway an agent has said um just read a query that was essentially the road meets deliverance and ya and now I want someone to write this for me please and someone replies not the original querer

and she said hi no the author did not Pitch it such or and the uh sample wasn't strong enough and this is not the only thing that this person has said but um I you don't do that no you don't you don't

really and if you do you don't phrase it like that because sometimes sometimes agents say I'm looking for a ya well like a ya Deliverance or uh a vampire Presumed Innocent or you know they'll come up with something that's

kind of strangely specific that they want to see and if it's and you can you can say that it is fine to say that you don't have to add because some another because an author pitched that to me and they

weren't good enough to write it themselves that's that's where you have crossed the line into just being horrible yeah and the thing is uh ideas are not copyrightable if uh one thing that's a awesome in our little writing Workshop

we have twice a month uh on the patreon where where we it's called kick in the pants because all you have to do is write a thousand words or 30 minutes on a prompt and we always get very

different pieces of fiction from the same prompt but still it's just it's just the whole like decorum you don't say hey I've just dumped my agent this person who is at this address and I'm going to tag them on social media and

say they were awful and they owe me money it's like no you don't you just don't do that um and then someone else found I mean if they owed you money I uh uh I would forgive some lapses but uh

actually it's going to depend on the sum of money over time yeah well it's also there's an equation that would probably work it out but okay we'll have we'll have to there probably is something math out there that will tell us at what point do you

name and shame but I think most of us are of the opinion that you don't do that I mean even people who've told me that they want to leave an agent they'll tell me like the download like at cons looking to the side to make

sure no one else can hear and we'll say I'm thinking of leaving my agent can you tell me about X Y or Z who I should talk to but it's like I know very few people who would do that

um because you know it's a professional relationship and even if you don't feel you've been professional when they go low you go lower is never a good look so this agent has also um apparently said that she's a

writer okay the last thing I want is a is a writer claiming I consciously or subconsciously stole their book idea from myself as a human I cannot control what sticks in my back brain and what might at some point whether in an image

or a character name or a plot point or line of dialogue come out again I read so many things over over the course of a day week month year I have no idea what I'll retain and what I won't the good

thing is I have no time to deviously sit here and plagiarize something outright the bad thing is I read so much that certain ideas are bound to stick how do I avoid these ideas emerging in my own writing I don't know but I urge

squeamish litigious writers not to query me I trust and respect writers and want the same courtesy in return okay if a writer reluctant to show me their work or legitimately thinks I'll steal it which you just said you might

do I can't be bothered with them there are lots of other talented writers and worthwhile projects out there I mean this is one of those weird things where it's not necessarily that she's wrong but you shouldn't have said it yeah

exactly like because yes ideas do come from everywhere and we are all like subconsciously dragging them in from our reading material all the time like I wrote an entire book where the bad guys were had the same name as the ones in

George R Martin's books which I I read the first like one in college and hadn't read any others at that point and like half and the editor didn't catch it either and my agent didn't catch it the movie wasn't or the TV show wasn't a

thing yet and then like right before I was like wait a minute actually you were the one who saved me m i I was yes you showed me a set of Game of Thrones Valentine's oh okay and I looked at one

of them and uh I think it it's the doth rocki was the name of the the the group and I looked at it and was like wait a minute that's the wait a minute now again this was certainly not an

intentional plagiarization first of all because it' be stupid yeah like I mean everyone would notice that but it was just that I groped around for a word or for a name for these people and that was a word that showed up and I

was like all right that'll work because i' read you know the first book in college years earlier and so thank God we caught it you know and since then I have gone to naming virtually all of my uh uh races and about half of my people

people after the Latin names of plants which has fixed a lot but I think what you should do is you should shorten them with apostrophes because no one's done that I don't know might be a little too AV on guard for the the

genre but the thing is that that having said that and and yes if you are in a panic that someone will steal your ideas that is that is a very um early fear I suppose that many writers have because

you love your idea and you're and you're like terrified that someone will take your idea away and before you realize that if you you know give 10 writers an idea you get 11 different books yeah uh because two of them are overachievers

and two of them didn't turn it in um one of them didn't turn it in I don't know so anyway it works out but uh it's yeah it it's I I sort of feel like with very very rare exceptions that the I'm afraid

of someone stealing my idea should be met with compassion rather than derision yes there are a couple loons out there who will try to sue everyone but that's in any field I mean it doesn't matter if you make you

know tires or pornography there somebody's going to say you stolen their idea uh it's I'm not suggesting you combine the two okay you're you you have yeah I I picked two genres that seemed unrelated anyway the point is you

you the point is that it's better to be you know like like honey that's not a problem relax then like yeah I'm totally doing it cuz everybody does it I mean that's I suppose but yeah you know you

you don't you don't call up a friend and say I had a really good poop today although we assume you have at some point recently because you're still alive but we don't need to hear it yes and you know there are so many things

that we don't need to hear and and I hear you on the the whole like you do internalize things my first book was or my first book with orbit was Hitcher guide and monsters instead of aliens and I didn't even realize it it

it was shocking it was stupidly shocking to me because I loved that book so much in college which is probably why it got planted and and took root and did not leave but you know what you said about

people being afraid of stealing your ideas that is why that's one of the biggest reasons I started um I should be writing because and it was because of someone you and I both know and I was thinking oh we should have a writer

group and they said oh no no I'm afraid someone's will steal my ideas and I'm thinking I I don't think that happens a lot and and also I I don't how are you going to get anything published ever if

you really want to follow this path how are you going to get over this fear except and the thing is that I there is a phenomenon for lack of a better word where because and I assume this is because it's sort of the

hundredth monkey thing where uh there you will get a Spate in one year where everybody has uh books about fungus horror or whatever that's the one I always hear about because I had one and uh it's you know it is not that we are

all stealing from each other it's that we probably all read the article in Scientific American about ceps fungus at the same time when it went around the internet three years ago and now it's out or uh and sometimes they get very spefic

specific like in fact that was the reason I did not make it Corps I was like very clear it is not Corps because everybody's doing Corps uh it was like someone who had an anthology said once that one year they got four Kudzu

takes over the world stories wow from four different writers and like that is so specific but obviously at some point there was an article or something and then there was the time Gap where things percolate and then everything comes out

that's it's gotten to the point and and I think Neil giman said once that when he was writing the serial killers convention Arc in uh Sandman he had the idea and then he was like oh [ __ ] this

is such a good idea I have to write this down because surely because he's like someone else will think of it a and because I'm amaz this hasn't been done yet and it's a uh and at that point it's

not that anyone's stealing it's just oh God I'm rushing me the first to publication kind of thing uh I can only think of one time in my entire career that I have had an idea that struck me as so

original that I was actively worried someone else would publish it first and uh jokes on you it's coming out in 20 25 26 I don't know something like that maybe 20 well anyway it's at my editor I wrote it already are

tells what it is yeah uh I wanted to know what would happen if botflies uh if a vampire had bot flies the botfly one yes yes and uh so there is a a Gestalt sort of but but not no it's never

plagiarism it's never someone is stealing my idea it's always oh [ __ ] everyone else will have thought of this yeah oh crap uh and and yeah that's a phenomenon um but at the same time even if there are five kudu

stories uh as we always say you have not written a kadu story well we don't say the KSU part you know you haven't written it it's why fairy tale retelling story it's the same story in every fairy tale you know every Sleeping Beauty is

the same Sleeping Beauty but the versions of it are so dramatically wildly different that it's not you know that you haven't written yet so you know don't worry about it yeah yeah and that said once in a thousand years or so a

you will have an idea or and scaly said once that he actually had a a book that was uh most of the way written and another one got published and he and his editor mod looked at it we

like God damn it nope can't put this one out now because of reasons he has never got into that but I mean there are times when just like there are sudden amazingly great confluences of times to get an idea out there are also amazing

confluences of oh [ __ ] uh like this is why writing near future is so impossible most people I know have given up uh but anyway long story short worrying about people stealing your ideas is very very uh like no that's not the problem there

are worst things that Pro that can and probably will happen to you during over your career yeah it's and it's very rare that your idea frankly is is that amazing I hate to say it many of my ideas are very stupid hog father by

Terry pratchet one of the greatest books ever written is about using the Tooth Fairy to kill Santa Claus that is objectively a stup idea yeah but it's brilliant because he wrote it yeah yeah um I forget where I was going with that

all ideas are stupid they're all just trying to drag them up to standards of publishability yes I have um yeah I'm determined to make my red shirts meets Hallmark Christmas movies um uh story work but there's a uh the thing I always go to

is take a young woman and give her powers that she doesn't understand and make her special and put it in vampires and make the hottest vampire fall in love with her for absolutely no reason and then you've got Buffy the Vampire

Slayer Twilight Sunshine by Robin McKinley and which you haven't read go it yes yes Sunshine's actually quite good sunshine just feels like Bakery porn I remember almost nothing about the vampire bit but the fact that the that the main character was a baker and talks

about her job a lot was just made me very hungry I uh it's it's really good it is it is a very very good take on on vampires and everything else I enjoyed it I wish you'd written more in that

world but his life yeah so uh yeah if and those that's a that feels like a very specific description and yet those are four very different stories um I have once in my life uh and in fact I think I talked to you about this in

while uh reading for blurbs I had two stories come across my desk simultaneously that were the same like not but they were the same plot and the style was very similar and they were by two different authors at two different

houses and there was no way that they could know each other and it was such an extraordinarily unusual phenomenon that I was like talking to my agent and and my writer friends going any of you ever seen anything like this before because

that never happens that was that was the struck by lightning while being eaten by a shark kind of thing that it genuinely never happens it was so weird does the shark die in that scenario uh I think if the shark's eating you you

get a pass on not feeling bad about the shark I'm not worried about the shark I'm just asking shark worried about the shark I might have been an endangered shark okay so so when the lightning strikes you while you're being eaten by

an endangered shark the point is you worry about the shark I once assuming I had lived through this scenario was on Shore and there was a tourniquet over the stump and you know my heart was slowing down from the

however many Kila jewels of whatever I would I would probably be like what happened to the shark man where's the shark and then later if I had recovered I would be like well wasn't the shark fall shark was just

eating you know a primate that happened to be it area mhm that's true and the lightning was nobody's fault so yeah we are uh apparently suffering an ad Break Even though I ran an ad at the very beginning so this wouldn't happen

I'm not sure I haven't gotten the notice I just got the notice one was coming but it hasn't actually said it started yet I still think this whole ad thing on Twitch uh is not quite it's very unwieldy but um

yeah so we we we we basically said someone okay now the ad break's in progress okay so we can uh take a moment to relax and get some water if you want or Ursula can Vamp but I know the people

who uh are missing Ursula vamping will probably be very unhappy with it so yeah um can I go blow my nose you can go blow your nose go for it yay I'll be back well it says an ad is in progress so I

don't Frosty tools says an ad is in progress usually when Frosty tools says it it's right there it is okay hey fire rider hi hi hi M hi Kevin [Music] I return all right we're all back it looks like and um we we got a driveby

hello from Kevin K Kimmy says hi Kevin um I I will I will relay everyone's eyes when he's back from communing with his chickens okay um yeah it it well it's funny that that we went from saying this woman

was off just being not not not acting well but her core statement is fine but it's just it's just you don't say it and you don't say it like that and you aren't derive about the the authors contacting

you and yeah and you don't yell at them that they're cowards because I mean we deal with enough author anxiety we don't need to hear that we're cowards too yeah and yeah it's it's you shouldn't say it like that and it's you

know it's like anything else there there are people who are are when there are people who are starting out who are lower on the lad than you are be nicer to them do not do not you know do not stomp on their fingers and

tell them that you know they're having first rung problems or whatever yeah first strong problems yes uh asking for an idea is fine but they didn't need to say it came from another pitch yes um yeah well if anybody has

any questions um go ahead and ask them in the chat and remember you if you're listening to this later you can ask and we will answer we try to stream every other Monday on Twitch 3 p.m. eastern Daylight time right now um on twitch.tv/

Mighty and I say all that Monday 3M Streaming every other week there we go um send in your questions we like questions otherwise I just sit here and start blathering about czu yes yes well they would like that too um oh we have a

new theme song which the chat has not heard yet but it does mention you and your slime mold speeches yay yes I uh uh uh just had to record a set of acceptance speeches um the Locust uh Awards have been awarded

and I am extremely honored I want to this is not me attempting to talk about that but I didn't hear that yeah thank you uh but the thing is I was nominated in three categories and they wanted you

know three speeches essentially and I was like okay it is highly unlikely that I will win three frankly I thought it was unlikely I'd win two uh I mean I'm not saying it was likely I'd win even one

but like two is just getting you know so the first speech was basically me saying thank you I'm very honored I deliberately did not mention what work it was for or name the editor and uh and then just started

talking about Eastern skunk cabbage which can uh produce its own heat it's one of the only endothermic plants and why it does that and uh then you know thank everyone and the second one I was like you only get one clever speech for

award ceremony thank you all do not trust the skunk cabbage and the third one was just me going is this a trap and uh so they played two of them apparently so I'm kind of glad they didn't do this

is this a trap I'm I'm I gotta say uh Martha Wells won both fantasy and science fiction novel awards for Locust yep so good for you Martha system collaps and witch King wooho yeah Locust fans don't like me I

don't know it's it's like uh uh reviewers like kirkus can like you or Publishers weeky weekly can like you but both of them will not like you it's and if kirkus likes you you are riding the tiger and sooner or later you

will fall off and they will Maul you I have kirkus tiger before yeah I actually got away with not falling off the tiger by virtue of never writing another children's book there you go yeah I'm sorry I'm looking at all the

other winners uh Locus Awards have been awarded and all the information is up um Ursa Kaya Gwinn won a Locus award which is good for her I it's good to see she's finally getting some recognition yes yeah okay anyway uh way me me whining that

that I don't get Award nominations is uh pretty pretty privileged um it's okay we are we are doing a podcast about people you know in in their careers not you know early on and it is it is a thing that people worry

about is like you know I I write the Books people pay me for the books but no one you know gives me Awards why not and it's uh I think there is a certain extent to which uh it

is you know how critics movie critics after a point hate movies that everyone loves because they have seen them all by now and so they like the weird Avant guard [ __ ] uh there is a certain extent to

which you can be a very good writer but if you are writing within certain genres and or sub genres I guess in this case if you you are not a if you are just a writer and not a writer's writer

kind of thing yeah then uh and then you know you get fewer rewards and the other problem there is that it's not all that common that you can if you write stuff that's weird it damn it hound hound it's just

me uh the if if you write stuff that is that is that the critics like the are pretty good that the wider reading public is not is going to be like what the hell is this yeah so uh you can get money or people can their

critics can like you pick one I suppose also once you're there's also a certain once you are in the the uh what am I looking for the the Gestalt of uh the people who vote on these you are

much more likely to get subsequent ones once you break into it uh for exle uh the ram stoker award has no idea I exist and i' I've written a number of horror novels I've won awards for horror Noels

but the stoker is like what who yeah and which is fine I'm not saying I need one I'm just saying you know it's or or the world fantasy award you know never uh nominates me for stuff which is fine

it's it's a different group yeah no you're right and I got to be the Toastmaster at World fantasy and tell them all about Terror Birds so it was a good good G awesome but they still don't nominate you for

anything it's fine I I don't I don't need all of them okay one would be nice but I don't need all of the they it is not Pokemon the the buff does not stack it's it's fine I nominated you your book

oh thank you that's very sweet um we do have uh someone wanting to share some good news in the chat um give us good news my dad passed recently so to honor him I published my first module on DM's Guild it's free it's not

really sold but last I checked it's almost 100 units sold it's my first sale publishing wise I am I am torn I I was about to say that's awesome but I'm very sorry about your father my sympathy it is awesome

that the thing you have done and to honor him has has started selling that's fabulous yes that's excellent it's always good to have uh qu uh sorry validation that's word I'm looking for yes and RPG modules are hard oh yeah

I've tried to write some and I'm like God this is messed up like how do I possibly account for any of the zillion things that the Little Darlings will take in their heads to do yes I have been a module breaking player and

suddenly on the other side I'm like God I'm an [ __ ] yeah I can hear your husband in the background laughing even if he's not hearing you he's finding a reason to laugh and he'll figure out why

later yeah the the the soul is laughing yeah um so do you have anything you want to address besides don't be an [ __ ] which apparently still needs to be uh mentioned it's uh look it is fine to

say I read a book about this and it sucked or even I got a pitch and it sucked although I wouldn't necessarily do that myself my my rule of thumb is if I have read a bad book and and I do and I want

to vent about it I either do it completely in private to my my writer group yes uh or if I'm going to talk about it on like social media or something because it came up you know and usually it's just a you know a oh I

read a book about that uh I do not include the author name I include no information that I can find that would be identifiable unless they are either so much richer than me that they do not care Stephen King George R Martin

uh and Etc or that lady in Scotland thank you yes or they are dead right uh because authors are people people and some of them still foolishly search their own names on social media don't do that kids if you're doing that I want

you to stop it is not good for you nothing you find will make you stronger happier or more joyful yes it will not fulfill anything in your life yes there is only Darkness there uh this goes doubly true if you find yourself on

Reddit oh God anyway I I used to read our fantasy and I would I would see my name on a comment and I would just close the thing like if I it wasn't if I have just read the greatest book in history I will

close the P thing because if they say it was the greatest book I've ever read I'm naming my children after the characters there was a type on page 300 I will be in the corner weeping yep uh so uh yeah

absolutely because because people don't become writers I guess yeah anyway uh or if they were when they started out they're not by the time they get here yeah no kidding yeah so just don't yeah just if you if you must [ __ ] about

something online strip it out of any identifiable information and I feel like uh it was uh the road meets Deliverance ya is maybe a little close to identifying information particularly when it's in the context of someone who queried me because then uh

all the people who who queried you are are going wait was that my book yeah whereas if I'm online you know going man this book about Yeti just did not work for me uh it it I mean it almost got there

and then just know uh what there are so many book about Yeti who's going to know who it was other than the person three comments down who was like was it so and so by such and I'm like yes but I didn't want to say it um

yeah because there's always that person yeah I I'm always amazed um we recently lost Janet Reed who was doing query shark for years and she did so much to help people out with their queries and um I thought was very brave that people

would send because to have query shark do your query she would put it on her blog so everyone would see and then she would critique it and everyone would see what um not only what your book's about but how you were critiqued from the

query shark was there a comment section I'm actually not sure I could I could probably do that but not with a comment section MH I would never do that now I would be like whatever I'm writing the damn books they

are what they are they are written I can't fix it now but uh yeah but a comment section I would yeah yeah definitely um yeah so it's but but even but sometimes if if if Agents come on to say

I'm not getting the the the queries I'm I'm hoping for or you know they're not going to say and this one about baseball only done by rats um just did not was really extra stupid and just not you

know not good yeah don't don't put anything down if you're going to speak obliquely about something and there are plenty of reasons to if you would be able to identify your book from that you need to you need

to go back another step of opacity yes yes indeed um well it doesn't look like we have any questions um I guess we can go ahead and end this and we'll hopefully be back in two weeks that'll be early July you will

be in Finland how long you stay in Finland uh look um I uh this may um it's June now and almost done with Jude well I have a doctor's appointment on the 15th so I think I'll be back before

then okay did that answer my question I'm not sure you you still don't know when you're coming back you just know you're back by the 15th yeah uh I leave this Sunday and I don't know if I'll be back uh for

the ditch diggers after that that Monday uh I'll Pro I'll be back later in the week but I may be super jet lagged or something okay or not here until the evening because time zones how do they work we'll figure it out I mean we've

already almost done half of last year's ditch diggers so I think we're still going at a good rate yay but um if you want to send questions yes send questions I can I can pretend to be Matt and be like a bad cop

no Matt's Matt's mellowed Matt's uh not not quite so bad cop anymore yeah I can try to be it could just be you life affirming cop oh boy you could you could but you you you know I I wanted you to be my

co-host because of you a I feel the love I won't look it up on Reddit though no don't don't look up the Love on Reddit um anyway to find out more about me you can go to m.com that's

m r v RS e and that's where you'll find me I'm hoping to do some interesting uh videos soon but God knows I have I'm very ADHD with my cool ideas and follow through we'll see but I have been

podcasting since 2004 so I got that going for me but uh where Ursula where do we find you uh you find me online at Red wbat studio.com uh or go to Blue Sky I am T Kingfisher um you can find most of my

books uh for all of my books for adults are under the name t king fisher you can find them and read them only go to Twitter when my publisher pings me now this podcast was produced under creative comments attribution

non-commercial no derivatives license music provided by divos spice divos spice.com ditch diggers this is a free podcast brought to you by the kindness of our patrons if you would like to also be kind and a patron go to

patreon.com Mighty yeah I don't I don't go there anymore because of scariness yeah it's it's bad but like if the publicist is like will you retweet this yes I'm going to retweet this because there's evil and then there's

trying to explain myself to a publicist and yeah yeah