Why Technical Development Still Matters | Tony Colbert

Really analyze what you're doing at the start. Is it making them a better player, or is it just taking the time up to get them ready to play? But at the end of the day, to be a good player, technically you need to have contact with the ball. That means repetition with the ball. It doesn't mean you to me, me to you, you to me, me to you. It needs purposeful connections with the ball. The first 10, 15 minutes of your training period. Then you go into your possession-type work or your rondo-type work. Uh, and in that 15 minutes, the objective from just [music] purely from an analytical point of view, I would try to get 120 contacts with the ball.

[music] Purposeful contacts. So you're looking about 60 first touches or 40 to 50 first touches, not just first touch but first touch into the space and all the little nuances that come about it.

So you're working on that over and over, over and over daily. Trust me, it comes out.

Hello, coaches. Welcome back to another Modern Soccer Coach interview. Big one this week. Tony Colbert spent 20 years with Arsène Wenger as first team coach at Arsenal. He is now a FIFA technical expert doing a lot of work around technical activation. That's where this conversation goes. It goes to his philosophy around technique and his work around technical activation. You're going to love this here. Please make sure you like. Please make sure you subscribe. Massive thanks to Tony for jumping on. Here he is. Enjoy.

Tony, thank you so much for joining me today. Modern Soccer Coach Podcast.

Really excited for this one.

No problem. A pleasure to meet you, Gary. I've looked at some of your stuff online and, uh, the vibes are good and the quality is good and the content's excellent. So, I'm more than happy to speak with you.

Fantastic. Fantastic.

All right, we've got to start at Arsenal. We just had a quick chat there. Uh, 20 years. I didn't know that you had started in '98. So, you got 20 years under the great man Arsène Wenger. What did that environment scream about developing elite players for you?

Well, there were many facets to it, but first and foremost, it was the professionalism of the man himself. You know, um, he set an example to everyone of professionalism, of commitment, of the quality of everything. So, he not only changed the way players trained at that time, he changed the way they thought about preparation. He changed the way that I think football thought about preparation. I mean, everyone's talking about the diet and things like that, but it wasn't so much that; it was the professionalism of the session. Everything was about highest value. How could we make the sessions more effective for the player?

What do the players expect from the quality of the training? That was important to him. He wanted to know what they expect and what he expected of them as professionals, how to commit their lives and how to, um, I would say live their lives as a professional. And so it became everything was about pulling together as a team, as a process to develop the best quality football, the best quality entertainment, and the best of what they could do as young humans and sportsmen. As simple as that. So it's hard to put it into words, but he was a real pioneer in that respect. You know, we got nothing but complete respect for him in that respect.

See the factor on change because we talk a lot today about culture changes and, you know, we referenced a few clubs in the chat that we were talking about and how difficult people are finding it. How when you're in the middle of that culture change and you're going through it, I love hearing about the training and actually putting an emphasis on the training. How, what are some keys to getting that culture changed over a long period of time?

I think one of the big things that I noticed is that you had some, in the early days, you had some big, big names there: Tony Adams, Steve B, Martin Keown, Lee Dixon, and they very, very, very quickly bought into Wenger because he offered them, I think, longevity in their careers because looking after their bodies more effectively, the training being more functional towards football rather than towards just like five other sides what would probably—it's not to take bullet—what was being done, but he was all about technical development, moving the ball quickly, giving them—and he gave them a new dimension to what their plan was about, you know. And of course, if you get early success like he did because after the first four seasons he won the Premier League and he won the FA Cup and they won it playing some really good football, then some they're going to buy into that, of course, because they're winners. They want to win. So he's brought them success very quickly, and I think the biggest part of that, in my opinion, was the quality of the players he brought into the club very quickly. We had Dennis Bergkamp who was there already, which was obviously a superstar, but then he brought in some unknowns that were frighteningly good in the first year. And if you get that sort of process going on, everyone wants a piece of that, and the players sort of bought into what he was doing but followed him quite blindly in the first couple of years because of that.

You know, I was a Man United fan growing up, Tony, and used to collect all the end of season DVDs, you know, and, um, coaching.

That was around the time 03-04 I started moving into coaching. So I would reference those DVDs for attacking football, but I got hold of like Arsenal end of season 04-05. And what I remember about those DVDs, I probably watched them more: the counterattacking, the pace on the break.

Yeah. Yeah. Obviously Henry, but you had Gilberto Silva in behind, physicality. There's a goal against Tottenham, a real famous Vieira goes.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. In today's world where we're mapping out sessions and we're looking at that there. How much of that?

It's, um, you're right. It's like from poetry to chess, isn't it? What the game's gone like. It's very much like chess now.

Um, is that a good thing? I don't know. For enjoyment. What was the crook about that was the fact that first and foremost we had monsters as players. Uh, and Arsène would always say 90% of the job is the player, which is right. We just, if we can provide them another two or three percent, then we're doing a good job, which he, and he's completely right with that. So the objective was to ensure that they was as creative as possible. He didn't mind runners as, and so there's no, there was no, you can't run, go forward like you say Gilberto going the whole length of a pitch, no problem. Someone would drop back in. So it was almost similar to the total football type of thing you could allude to back in the 70s even, but that was all about our training was about tempo, pace, speed, connections on the pitch, quality of movement. When one player moves, another player's available.

It was always like fluid, and part of that fluidity was from the right at the start of the session. So, our game was all about—and he won't mind me saying this—it was all about turning and playing forward. A lot of verticality, but a lot of creativity in that verticality and a lot of movement off the ball. And so, if you're doing those types of, if you're working on that type of training day in and day out, that comes out on the pitch. And if you've got the players that have got the physical and technical capacity to undertake it and to take it on to the next level on the match day, then what you see is what you did see: some of the most beautiful fluid football that has ever been played. And I would say footballistically we were a little bit better than Manchester United in that period from a football.

They had a lot of competitiveness, and it was wonderful. The competition against them was as pure as you're ever going to get in a modern game, and it's a litt

success like he did because after the first four season he won the Premier League and he won the um the FA Cup and they won it playing some really good football then some they're going to buy into that

of course because they they've they're winners. They want to win. So he's he's brought them success very quickly and I think the biggest part of that in my in my opinion was the quality of the players he brought into the club very

quickly. We had Dennis Bird Camp who was there already which was obviously a superstar but then he brought in some unknowns that were frighteningly good in the first year and if you get that if you get that sort of process going on

everyone wants a piece of that and the players sort of bought into what he was doing and but followed him quite blindly in the first couple of years because of that you know I was a Man United fan growing up Tony

and uh used to collect all the end of season DVDs, you know, and um coaching.

That was around the time 03 04 I started moving into coaching. So I would reference those DVDs for attacking football, but I got hold of like Arsenal end of season 0405. And what I remember about those DVDs, I probably watched

them more. The counterattacking, the pace on the break. Yeah. Yeah. Obviously HR, but you had Jabberto Silva in behind physicality. There's a goal against Tottenham, a real famous Vieira goes.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. In today's world where we're mapping out sessions and we're looking at that there. How much of that?

It's it's um you're right. It's it's like from poetry to chess, isn't it? What the game's gone like. It's very much like chess now.

Um is that a good thing? I don't know. For for for enjoyment. What was it? The crooks about that was the fact that first and foremost we had monsters as players. Uh and Arson would always say 90% of the job is the player which is

right. We just we if we can provide them another two or 3% then we're doing a good job which he and he's completely right with that. So the objective was to to ensure that they was as creative as

possible. He didn't mind runners as and and so there's no there was no you can't run go forward like you say Gilberto going the whole length of a pitch no problem someone would drop back in so it was almost similar to the total football

type of thing you were you you could allude to back in the 70s even but that was all about our training was about tempo pace speed connections on the pitch quality of movement when one player moves another player's available

it was always like fluid and part of that fluidity was from from from the right at the start of the session. So, our game was all about and he won't mind me saying this, it was all about turning

and playing forward. A lot of verticality, but a lot of creativity in that verticality and a lot of movement off the ball. And so, if you're doing those type of if you're working on that type of training day in and day out, that

comes out on the pitch. And if you've got the players that have got the physical and technical capacity to undertake it and to take it on to the next level on the match day, then what you see is what you did see some of the

most beautiful fluid football that has ever been ever been played. And I would say footballistically were a little bit better than Manchester United in that period from a football.

They had a lot of competitiveness and it was wonderful. the competition against them was as pure as you're ever going to get in in a modern game and it's a little bit gone now that sort of competition and

I would say the hunger to win then from both teams from both Manchester and um from Arsenal and then it got disrupted when Chelsea come along with all the money. So, um, yeah, going back to your to your question, it was all about the

quality of the player and our our training was fast, quick, and sharp. Yeah. And the level of of technical quality. Obviously, today the technical quality is is outrageously high at the highest level.

I disagree with that that you say it's outrageously high. I still think there's a lot of deficiencies in the technique of players. I think that that what's very good is that they see opportunity and they're they they they're quick at

making decisions and I think that part and parcel of that is because that it's all tight and very quick. But I see on every single game I watch, I've seen opportunities to play something that can't be played because they haven't got

the equipment to use to do that, you know. So, but yeah, at the highest elite level, it is still fantastic and it's it's very sharp and quick. Well, no, this is this is fascinating because when you when you're saying that that they're

lacking one or two things that was the kind of followup was it it seems like we are at an age where the physical prog advancements and obviously tactics have moved and yeah like I think technically again at the highest level what these

players can do but we also have a group of players underneath it who seem technically deficient in when you watch youth games today the solutions seem to A to B to C the solutions are all within the system and the numbers rather than

the ability of the players. He's correct. Yeah. Yeah. I agree with that. Yeah. Where has technical training gone for you over the last 10 15 years around the world? Um I travel um as a consultant for FIFA. Uh and I work with the talent

development scheme as part of I helped to develop part of of the curriculum i.e. The first part of training is is on the we what we use is called technical activation and we we go to I go to

various countries um with the MAS and and and and try to help them to develop and to to deliver that part of the training as best practice and on those trips we do quite a lot of filming as

well. And I would say because you've seen some of the stuff I put online that is with the players for the first time.

So it's they've never done that before. So, it's always the first first time exponents of it. To get what I put online takes a lot of footage and that gives you an idea what I'm trying to say there. It takes a lot of footage because

there's so much catastrophic passing that goes on. And I have I have pushed back on it a lot from from from people when I post. I have a lot of comments that say it's not cognitive. It's not decision- making. I agree with that

completely. there's no decision making per se, but it's leading onto the decision- making process because you're getting reliable mechanical technique to to to enable that decision- making process. But what I would say to the the people that push me back and very rarely

it's from elite people. It's from people that think they're elite but haven't had much time in elite sports and then they they spend sometimes days coming back to me with um their philosophy and they don't don't tend to respect who I've

worked for and they let me loose with the ball for 20 years. So what I done must have had some effect. But taking that out of the equation, what I would say is that I set up exercises, but you

can very rarely get that ball from one side of the circuit and back with good quality and movement quality, good timing, good technique, good passing, and good visual understanding because it's catastrophic. Because majority of young players do not scan for first.

That's first. When you see one or two that do, it's an exception. And I don't know, I like rondos and things like that, but it doesn't develop the scaling process. It de when I watched it and I've been in partial to Rondo, what

we used to call possession more than Rondo, but but yeah, it's still the same thing, but it's got a nice new name.

What players who developed with those type of exercises, they tend to develop what they're good at and they get out of jail with what they're good at and they certainly are quicker to make decisions.

There's no doubt about that. You can see that comes out quicker with their decision- making, but what they can't do, they still can't do because they're not putting it into an environment where they're forced to do it. So, with the

with the passing environments that I put together, like I said, when the the children I'm working with, the 12 to 15s mainly at the moment, it's very difficult without opposition to get the ball around with quality. So if it's

difficult without opposition, you can imagine how hard it is with opposition. So my argument to people that push back that back is that you see in every sport in the world, the top quality sports where there's a lot of contact with the

what you would call your your racket of of use. For example, tennis players, table tennis players, cricketers, basketball players, the ball is used all the time. But we may have sessions where the players may only touch the ball 40 50 times in a session

session because the youth coaches are talking talking. So that's why I think they've lost a little bit of the the technical development. They're very proficient at understanding and decision making, but they haven't always got the equipment to do it.

That's what I see where I go anyway. I've got very very strong views on coaching at youth level. You know what um one of the things I really um religiously push on in the technical activation that I put together is trying

to use both feet of course. Yeah. I think it's absolutely essential for the modern player and I'm only repeating what Arsenal would say that he says the modern player will need two feet. The modern player the the ball needs to be

their friend. They need to be able to receive it anywhere on the pitch and use it anywhere on the pitch. And in reality, that is not possible at all. If I give you a simple analogy, it was a

simple exercise I can do. You receive from the right, switch it to the left and play through the lines on the left.

Not on for most players. Not available. No chance. And that is these are people at elitemies. I haven't got that in the locker. How do I know? Because I filmed them there. And I can't even get a a

left rotation in the exercise because I can't show it because it's not quality. The quality is not good enough. So just just coming coming back on yourself, dropping in, turning, opening up, having a look across, taking it from the right,

switch it to the left, find the little 20 mters between the lines on the left diagonal for the person coming in from left to right. Not work going to work because 90% can't do that. So for me that's a sin for a youth coach working

with 10 12 year olds that should be religiously on that simple practice because then you open one side of the pitch to the player that he's not got because the brain won't let it in if it can't do it. Simple as that, you know.

And the objective of these type of exercises is to very very gradually but over a period of time rewire that hard drive that you can accept the brain accepts that movement opens up and can play that part. I'm just giving you that

simple analogy because it's it is a simple analogy and I would say I've seen it at top level as well. I've seen where we've worked on players that couldn't do that at the highest level. Not going to go into the names, but we had um players

that we wanted to right backs that we wanted to I mean to to receive the ball, slip it into the space and whip it around the back with the left between the lines over a period of six to eight,

nine months. The young players that come from we could get that in their game reliable enough that their mechanics could could allow them to forget about how to do it because it was in the locker. And then they could that that

receiving shifting and sweeping it around the back with the left foot from the right foot or right back. Yeah.

Sweeping it around the back with the left between the lines for the runner in the midfield that become mechanically strong enough that it could take the decision making and it could take combat as well at the same time because it'

hold up. Whereas before it wasn't strong enough the brain wouldn't let in it in.

It panics and where's it go? don't go straight back to the center back because oh I can't do that it goes back one because they don't look and two they haven't got the little you understand the movement I'm talking about obviously

yeah that little reverse around the back and that them little things on the pitches are all there everywhere and young players can't do them things so when I put the exercises together I I it's even where I go I have some comments

from some of the coaches to say you know it's all decision making I said well if we do the session this afternoon. Tell me how good your players are at the end of it. And they come to the same same

conclusion. No, they can't do it. So, why shouldn't why they should be able to, but they can't do the simple things.

They can do what they can do, you know, and it's not a period of time that's going to it's not a period of time we're asking for that's going to change anything on what you've got available to you. I'm only replacing rubbish.

Hello, coaches. We'll take a quick break here. As always, appreciate the support of the Modern Soccer Coach podcast. If you are enjoying this, and I'm sure you are with Tony, please make sure you give it a quick like. Please make sure you

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and don't forget to like and make sure you subscribe. Thanks so much. Back to Tony.

I mean, it's not it's not like you said that there's a simple piece of it that you've got to get the hard drive or the the foundation before you go into the complexity of decisions if you don't have the tools or

the whatever club in your back. Exactly. Yeah. I'll give you I'll give you a really simple analogy.

If if you have a you've got a car Yeah. that's got the automatic gearbox down the um console down here. So you've driving that for five years. You don't think about changing not changing the gear but the automatic just automatic.

You don't think about it. You change it to a car that's got it up at the dashboard. For three months your your mind goes to that eventually it goes to there. You change it back a year later for three months you're doing that.

You're hitting the windscreen wipers. How do I know? I've done it myself. So these automatic things come in just by the repetition of the mechanical movements just like a tennis player does. You know, I have the same argument

that I was talking long time ago to Federra because he came to an Arsenal match and when players came and be big sports, I always quiz them on what they done because I wanted to know. was always really inquisitive about his weakness

and he was played on his backand slice all the time. He said it just again and again and again and again and little things like that become so automatic then you don't think about playing it.

He thinks about the decision with it and that's what it gives you when you develop those little nuances. The younger the better as well. If I was uh I've got I'm a granddad, but she if she wants to play football when she's gets a

little bit older, I'll be on both feet straight away because that they're when they're really young, you're like a sponge. You develop so easily. It's much harder when you get older. It can be done, but it's um it's

something that needs repetition. And if you think about the early part of training for example, you go in majority of time still they'll do a little bit of running, few little strokes. Then they'll do a few little crossovers. Then they do some little up

and down legs. And I call it kicks, skips and flicks. Then they might do a little bit of in and out of the poles, in and out of cones at half tempo, etc., etc. 10 or 12 minutes is gone. They're

warmed up. They're ready. They do a few few accelerations, few change of directions and a little bit maybe a little doggy and impossible to someone or a volley come back and run away.

Yeah, that's everywhere on the everywhere in the world every day everywhere. Then we would go out straight ready with the ball. We've done all what we need to do in the gym to prepare. The players are prepared and we slowly but surely we're

straight with the ball. We would have 15 minutes every day with the work I done Monday to Thursday and about five or six minutes on a Friday pre-match, but not too much more. But in that time period, Gary, within a year, every player had

20,000 extra purposeful contacts with the ball. And I mean purposeful, all communication, all connections together.

So the next part of training, you are not only physically ready, and if I didn't think they were physically ready, I would do a little bit of acceleration, deceleration just to top it up, but you're physically ready in a

footballistic way. You're technically supercharged because you're it's like you've been practicing your violin or your piano before you do your conerto.

And your interpersonal connections are all fired up as well. So when you go into the possession, it's at another level. It's 10% higher. So that 10% higher gives you 10% more quality. So those little things, it's not I'm not saying having

an hour of this type of work. I'm saying a small period every day, especially with youth players because they need to work on their basic techniques.

Communication with the ball, I call it, you know, connectivity with the ball. Is that why you were careful? Or I maybe you weren't careful. Is that why you've gone with like activation is a big big part of that title because activation

means that it's the starting point and it's Yeah, I I looked on when I finished Arsenal with um Arsenal and as s wanted me to come in and put together what I was doing at Arsenal with FIFA for the

talent development scheme. It didn't have any name at that time because we called it we called it coordination. We would do coordination, football coordination. But I I thought it needed something because and I looked online technical activation didn't come up

anywhere. So I knew it was the first first. So we put it together with a hashtag on on FIFA on the training center because we wanted to impose it's the first part of training. And it's the it's activating the technique of of the

players but reinforcement for for for players that are developed but still development for players that are not developed. So a lot I have a lot of comeback on the fact that I'm telling players to scan all the time and you're

just telling them to scan. But the first thing of scanning is if you don't look you don't see. So if you create a habit to see the next part comes in. How do I know that? Because I've done it for

maybe eight to 10 years at Arsenal with some of the lesser players and it would come out in the Rondos then because I would look at what they're doing in the Rondos before and you see they're hardly ever scanning. and six, seven, eight

months down the line with what we were doing that was coming out and it would automatically come out when they received the ball to turn and play forward. So they'd always scan back. So we created that through the repetition.

And if you're a coach and you're allowing them players just to turn without looking, you're not doing a good job anyway. So you need to persist on those things because then you're optimizing that period of time because then they're

scanning 7,000 times a year even if it's enforced and that creates the habit the dashboard. You know the the the gear stick comes up here it's now the dashboard. It then becomes that and eight or nine or 10 year olds don't see

an awful lot to start with but once they've got the habit to turn it's always in there. It doesn't it's always it's a coordination. It's a mileination or a neuroplasticity of movement and and and triggers that enables them to see on

the pitch because why would you not get them to do it? And that come about with chap called Bora Pimra. I told Yugoslavian he was captain of Yugoslavia in 1982 World Cup and he was right-hand man of Borro. He' been for a long time

for the whole of Arsenal and a few years at um in Japan as well. Um, and I was doing the all the type of physical work that you would do through the hurdles, over the ladders, in the poles, power,

quick, sharpness, little ball on the end, little volley, bang. And I thought it was a, you know, so one day I said to, "What do you think?" She says, "I love it, but it's nothing to do with football."

D, you got me thinking, you know, I got a creative mind and then I started thinking I'd put the ball in. I asked him if I could use the ball with it and all that. And he he said, "Yeah." and

and me and Bor worked on a few things and then my creative mind came out and about a year later as said I really like what you're doing here and he gave me the license to really work on it and

think of the patterns and work on the rotations and how it could become efficient with 12 players working together with two balls and all that sort of thing because before that it was all like block boxes you know you pass a

ball their turn and play the other way in a turn it was nothing and I brought it into figures eights and the weaving in and the objective was to have every available reception from every single angle from facing play, left, right,

forward, center, offline, back to play and angle to play. So we have those all of those 360 degree taking of the ball on any foot. And again, just in that part of training, like I said, our players would have 20,000

extra connections to anyone else in the Premier League at that time. So that helped our fluidity. It helped our our quickness on on the pitch and it helped our autonomy in just having them runs off the ball. It wasn't the be all end,

but it it gave us a foundation and Arsenal would say he's even gone online and said that. So he said that it was the it contributed to the foundation of that that our football game, you know, otherwise why would he let me loose with

the ball every day. Yeah, it's a great term that it's a great term. Um, when a player like Ces Fàregas arrives from Barcelona, which would be, I would imagine, more of that Rondo type of accuracy.

Yeah. Yeah. How does he adapt or or what do you see in his game when he arrived at Arsenal?

Um, a sup super quality, a monster mentality, a monster mentality, and a young player that hated to lose all the things we used to love.

So um it's a it's a strange one here because I used to play a lot of tennis football with players and it was almost with the young players that came because I was first person to work with Ces

Fàregas when he come to the club because we would test him physically and have a look at him with you know in some of the stuff that I had done and then played tennis football and the tennis was like

a psychological test because I was decent with the tennis ball because I played it for many years didn't have no left foot but I was good. I played at a good level and all the players would say that and he was one that hated me. I

beat him but he beat me and he wouldn't let me come in at 15 until he could beat me and we really love that mentality that told me straight away which you don't always know what mentality he's got. From a footballistic point of view

he was Yeah, he was great. Arson wanted him really wanted him to turn forward with the ball quickly because he felt he had a good long ball, but he wanted him to work on that turn forward with the

ball quickly. So I used to work on that day in and day out, coming dropping in, turning quickly, receiving, little dribble pass, finding it left, finding minute right. And to be honest with you, Seth has come out and said all that in

in online as well. So yeah, what young player he was. It was unbelievable. Unbelievable. Um, yeah, you talked there about that absolute two-footedness. Something that I something else you've talked about and in your post, I love reading. It makes

does make you think opening period of training to develop players rather than simply warming them up. It's a bad habit we've got into, don't he?

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, why not? That's the thing, you know, because is it not sexy to work with the ball anymore? That's that's what seems to be the the sort of thing that's coming through. It has to be from from the

first moment we have to be working on decisions and cognitive things and I don't agree with that. I think um there is a period that you can work on purely work on the technique but I must say the

exercises must be good. Yeah, the exercises must be in the game. They must be little scenes that are in the game and everything I' I put online and that's nothing compared to what I developed by the way Arsenal. These are

just snippets of it. And in all honesty, if we didn't film an awful lot of it because it was, you know, but we did I did towards the end when I obviously I don't show that because it's copyright,

but you would not believe the speed and the movement. It's incredible. It is like football poetry. And it it it it sort of came in the game a little bit naturally as well because they don't think about the things. It's there. They

have the qualities. But going back to what I was saying, why would you not want the first part of training to be developmental?

Because what are you removing? I'm not saying I want you to not make your decisions in the rondo that you do. I'm saying that I go all over the world and in many cases I watch them in 40 minutes

in the gym, then another 10 minutes warming up again after the warm-up outside and then another 10 minutes doing pass to me and a little simple little passes with a third little layoff here and they're all lazy. So the the

exercises must be little scenes that are in the game. You must picture it and then you put it together. one or two scenes together and the players must understand what those scenes are and then you must act on them fast as possible with the

best possible technique and if you can do that it it's a good exercise thereafter the coach must persist on the details and if they don't persist on the details it's not worth doing the exercises then you give the doubters the argument

because it becomes passing activity rather than passing connectivity activity is a different thing I've seen Many many things online I don't like. I don't make comment but I don't like them because there's no connection and there's no movement of the ball. There's

no first and foremost everything about my stuff is first reception. It's not reception static reception movement. You shift the ball. So you get seven or eight thousand first touches again for the year more. So your first touch improves if it if the coach is demanding

the quality and the speed and the movement of the first touch and the and the different movements to the receiver spinning coming short dropping off all the types of things. Secondly you want the two or three players to connect at

the same time. So once the one's players moving the other players off and if you get all that and persist on that over a period of time the improvements you see are phenomenal. How do I know? Because I've seen improvements in the talent

development scheme in the last couple of years looking back after the players have been working on them. And you might say they become autonomous at what they're doing. And I I can I can understand that that it just becomes

patterns that they understand and can do. And I can see the argument there. But if that was just the whole of the training, I would say yes that you're you're right. But you're not you're given that to help the rest of the

training. So you'll see in the possession and the rondo is in the next part of training it's at a higher level.

So that forces the level as well you know and that's important. Yeah, what you described about the the daily and I think it's important to talk about this that I think a lot of coaches will say, "Yeah, we do technical

activation, but when you go in round environments and you're looking and saying the players are doing such an easy exercise that they're bored doing it and all of a sudden it gets sloppy, coach is looking somewhere else." Exactly.

There's activity piece and the intensity piece has to be there. You're saying? Yeah, it does. It has to be relating to the relating to like lines in a film.

You're working on your lines in the film, the scenes of a film. I put it as I I mean look I look at things where they'll do they do over the hurdles then they'll do a volley and come back and

they call it technical calculation. That's Has nothing to do with football. There's no place for that because you're not doing anything well.

It's like trying to to to do hip hip flexion and extension over hurdle and then a little pass back in. Hip flexion extension over hurdle. You're trying to play the guitar and the piano at the same time, you don't do nothing well.

So, you need to focus on quality and details. And if coaches were to do that, because this be honest, if you're talking about youth coaches, if you can help a young player to develop both feet, if you can help them to see more on the

pitch, if you can help them to stay in the moment every single moment, i.e. when they lose the ball or make a pass, they don't switch off. If you could do those three three things, you've done a good

job. If you take them to 15 and they got if they if they can see, if they can play both feet and if they don't switch off, you've got a chance to play because they're the three things that make the

difference. Add the speed to the to the to the equation of course and the phys physicality, but just from the technical tactical, the biggest thing in tactical thing is is the speed of your processing something. So if you work on those

things, so you will hear me say back in quickly. Get back in. Get back in. Even after the simple things early, get back in. And then you recover. So if you impose that daily and do it vigorously, then habits become reflexes. And once

they're a reflex, then you've you've done that job. That's ticked off. And then you can work on the decision. If you look at Rodri, all the things Rodri does are simple, but he does them really well. He's got a good range pass on it.

He quickly sees he shifts the ball quickly. He drops into space quickly and he he follows up quickly. So he he's like Silva done that 20 years ago. Got didn't get any of the credit that he should have

gone at that level. He was even better for me. Much better. But no one talked about him because we had we had B camp etc. that were unbelievable. Lindberg unbelievable. Perez like a poet you know. And of course in United you have

players like that as well like Roy Keane and you had um Gixie and all that and Beckham and all that but on a different level but Rodri is like could be Balandor doing this most simple things you can imagine you know.

Yeah it's it's incredible. I mean, you're talking as well at a time where, not to keep going back to, but I'm just fascinated by it. The movement DNA that you referenced and I I read some of that there and like God, but when you were at

Arsenal, you're looking then at at a tight hybrid pitch as well of those combinations.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Very much. Yeah. So, the movement has to be good. It has to be fluid. Um, and you you had that um just the hunger to turn and play forward quickly. But that was Arson's DNA, hunger to turn and play forward. He

would hate if you play the ball back and you didn't need to hate it and he wouldn't mind me saying that either because it's true in your eyes.

How much of you said a little bit at the start about like he he saw a responsibility to play a brand of football.

Yeah. entertain. Yeah. Um is that again part of the culture of playing a certain way? Again, we've gone into this philosophy mode at the minute, but now everything looks a little bit the same.

It does, but then you've seen um the ones who flipped that around a little bit at PSG when they when they played with Bayern Munich last year against PSG was a beautiful game.

Yeah. But that I I correct me I might be wrong but I see 10 20 30 of those games five or 10 years ago in in week to week maybe not four five four but certainly that kind of fluidity on the pitch and

that kind of creativity you know and I I do see I see that the game is really analyzed to death and I think some people that analyze it they look at the shape they look at the form they look at that

moving while the other player moves at the same time creating the time of movement like when you see a a defense splitting vertical ball now it's like wow unbelievable but you know few years back that was that was there in the lot I could show

you hundreds of them yeah I I just on that Tony as well I saw one the other day where where Cariger was was talking about United before the red card and he was talking about a move and he was talking about a 20 pass

sequence and it was a good run from the diagonal but it was but to your point Like even for me as an analyst, I'm like, "Yeah, but that was that's just a ball by Fernandez into space and he's just found

him." It was a brilliant ball, but it wasn't I think now we're looking for something to be as complex as possible so that people Yeah.

Yeah. I think young young coaches that come into the game again I just think with young young players if you can get them to do the things that really make it not the marginal gains but the maximal gains and

the big maximal gains like I've said for me personally if you've got two feet you've got a weapon and and if you see on the pitch you've got a weapon that's why I love Cole Palmer I love Cole

Palmer as a player because he's he's a football player you know he's not a he's not a physical specimen he's a football player first and foremost. Um, I'm glad to see him having a good good good season so far because we need that type

of player in in the Premier League, you know. All right, last couple for you pieces of advice in terms of a coach who who's listened to this and is probably actually relieved probably. I think some coaches are relieved that they need, you

know, I think they need to hear that listen, you can work on technique and you can do this and it does matter at the highest level because there's so much commentary going the other way.

Should they Tony be designing their own session, their own exercises in this or how would you advise them to kind of get started or embrace it?

That's a difficult one really because uh I can only give an advice from what I've done. Um I would say definitely embrace it. It's don't don't spend hours and hours on it. Of course not. But I would say

if you go online at top level they're all doing they're all doing their own little rhythms. Sometimes I think it's a little bit too low level. It's not there's not enough tempo in it. But that's the coach needs to that whoever's

doing it needs to do it with the highest level of quality. And if you can do that, then you're you're making a difference. But it's if you look at just really analyze what you're doing at the start, is it making them a better player

or is it just taking the time up to get them ready to play the game? But if it's making them a better player, you think it's making them a better player, then fine. But at the end of the day to be a

good player means that you mean to be a good technically you need to have contact with the ball. That means repetition with the ball. It doesn't mean you to me me to you. You to me me to you like we alluded to. It needs

purposeful connections with the ball the first 10 15 minutes of your training period. Then you go into your possession type work or your rondo type work. I mean you I have comments where people say they go straight into boxes but you

know a 5'2 box is fun or 6'2 sometimes a 6'1 what's the point of that what's developing there so who's who's developing who and work on the weaknesses of players individually look at the weaknesses even in that period you know just it's hard

to put it into into into perspective but you need to prepare the players early on three levels technically physically and interpersonally Because the normal warm up and I done the normal warm-ups for about five or 10 years and then gradually it dissipated

away less and less time and then down to zero time and the players had to be prepared before they come out and it was their objective and the physios and people strength conditioning coaches inside which would help them with 10 15

minutes similar to what they do now. Now they put the different labels in it match day minus one max day minus two but don't fit we're doing that a little while back you know. Yeah.

And all the different runs that they do, it's all online. And you know, I used to run up the hybrid steps. Is that what people thought I was doing? You know, at the end of the day, that's all been

done. That's all been done. And most of it's been done better. But if they're ready, they're ready to start with the ball. They should be ready to start with the ball. Football pitches for football, you know. And I will say another thing

because you said I had a quick look at your questions. You said about elite players. What is the the thing about elite players and all that and how they how they sort of come out and to to an elite level and for me it's on

the pitch is the biggest thing for a player. Players don't become better players in the gym. They become better players on the football pitch. Gym is a substitution when they're injured and it can be detrimental when they're injured

as well because it can change them what they are a little bit if they get over overkill in the gym.

But as a football player, it's the minutes on the pitch. I would always say in the 20-y year period I was there, players that were rarely injured, they always went on to develop better because they had them minutes on the pitch. You

know, in training, they saw the training pitches every day. So, brilliant, brilliant. Last one. from a from a technical director standpoint of someone who's looking at again changing their programming around this and introducing it and really committing to

it. Would you would you put a time limit on this here if you were a director um going clubwide and saying listen first 15 minutes or 12 minutes or Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I I I I we

we we used 15 minutes which is I mean basically it was says you've got 15 minutes I want more he come back now you got 15 minutes so it was 15 minutes and he he loved it he loved the work because

he felt it g it it it brought something it gave something not take away because you can easily take away by what you're doing the the biggest thing in football is a small footprint with a big impact the smaller the footprint but the bigger

the imp impact act in the game in that in the game the better. So we're always trying to give without taking away that is the main thing. So I would say yeah 12 to 15 minutes but we went down the 15

minutes route. Uh and in that 15 minutes the objective from just purely from an analytical point of view I would try to get 120 contacts with the ball purposeful contacts. So you're looking about 60 first time first touches or 40

to 50 first touches. Not just first touch, but first touch into the space for and all the little nuances that come about it. So you're working on that over and over over and over daily. Trust me, it comes out.

Can you do the same if if you do the same thing every day, is that a negative as they get used to it or Yeah. Yeah. I I about 200 different variations. Two 250 different variations, which was sometimes it was

mixed up. Look, it's same thing mixed up. But it all there was certain principles that were always in there.

turn the player forward quickly if possible. I'd have a receiving from one side switching that play to the other, finding runners, dropping it in, running off, find a runner behind, and I'd even do our even our speed work. I would do

it because I'd make it longer, I called it speed, technical coordination. So, it had the speed element, the technique element, and the coordination element.

And I if I felt the speed wasn't there, then I'd finish off with the maximum speeds and some accelerations, decelerations to get the the physical component in there. But for me, Gary, if you're doing a 40 50 meter high-speed

run, it's far better if you're timing a run and you're playing a cross on the end of it because you've got the opportunity to play a right footed cross in behind on the end of it or a left

footed cross in behind on the end of it. So, if you're doing 16 repetitions, you've got eight left footed crosses and eight right footed crosses. So you're adding to your technical exposure and you're adding to your technical exposure

at speed finding a runner and the runner is making a run the other side making 15 20 m speed behind run. So you're taking away the the incomplex nature of just a straight line running and you're adding connections

but you're getting the you're getting the volume and the exposure at the high speed runners that you require. So I would always do that on the pitches after um we'd played and that was very difficult as well if you just lost a

game 3-0 and you you're telling them to make runs and behind being and finish on goal and I would do it with all of the players because there was no harm in the defenders making the runs and finish on

goal because all you're taking away is the dead running space. You're just creating technique. You're creating coordination. You're creating a long pass. You're creating timing of a run.

So that adds to the value to their training experience, you know. Yeah. God's music to my ears, Tony. The long stopping a training session to watch high-speed runs and going back into the session has killed me as a

coach. Going back into the session as well. Yeah. Yeah. I can't say I never done them, but I I I gradually kicked him out and and I I hated doing them after the games when we'd lost, especially, but you had to do it. But

what I used to do is I used to run with them. So, and and if they didn't, I just carry on running. So, I forced them into I forced them into it. You know, when it's horrible at 10:30 at the Emirates

on a rainy night, a Wednesday and you've got a Saturday game. So they didn't have time to to do he anything heavy. So they had to have the intensity and so yeah we used to do high speeded runs of course

but the majority of the time I fixed it into connections with a finish on goal as well and they don't realize they're doing the work then.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Enjoy because it's hard and if if the GPS said they didn't hit enough then I top them up at the end of it you know and the speed the maximum speed. Yeah. I top them up. But nowadays it's like

Curve run is the new thing. I've doing curve runs 27 years ago. Curve runs with maximum speed as if it's never done. Curve run deceleration and cut back. This is the new thing of timing it and this the body load and

this how much it costs them. It's been done. They got to work to keep themselves in jobs, don't they?

Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Fantastic here. This was amazing. I've loved every minute. Fantastic. Thanks. Okay, man. Take care. Talk to you again soon.

All right, coaches. I hope you enjoyed that interview as much as I did. We try and do as much variety in our topics as possible at Modern Soccer Coach. We try to bring in the experts on the different

types of coaching. And I think what this conversation does is it brings a focus back to something that is maybe lost over the last few years. Again, I come from a tactical analyst background, but even I can see that the emphasis or the

focus that's been on tactics over the last few years, yeah, it's great. It's progressive, etc., etc., but it's missing a big big piece at the youth level. And doing a lot of work at the youth level at the minute. We're putting

out a lot of ebooks, a lot of content around there. And the teaching of the game and the teaching of the understanding and the teaching around techniques has to go alongside each other. It's not just one or the other.

So, I thought it was a real breath of fresh air actually Tony coming on and like I said to Tony during the interview, I think some coaches will listen to this and be relieved that they do have strong beliefs around the

technical side of the game and it's fine. It's fine to lean into that there and work around that there as Tony says, as long as you bring that back to the game, as long as it's relevant, as long

as it adds value. I thought this was fantastic. If you enjoyed it, please make sure you like and subscribe. And if you want to go one step further, share it to your coaching community. Share it to a couple of coaches. Start some

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Always appreciate the support. Thanks so much. Because of your support, we can bring on people like Tony. We're continue to raise the bar with the conversation to bring on as many experts around as many different topics around football as we can. So, thanks for all

you do and I hope you enjoyed it. See you next week.