Climate Adaptation: Preparing Vancouver's Workforce for Coastal Reality

Hello and welcome again. Um, uh, really excited to be here. My name is Leslie Dampier, and I'm the program coordinator for the Climate Solutions Research Collective at UBC. You'll find me in the back corner over there a little bit later on if you're interested.

later on if you're interested. So the climate solutions research collective is an initiative that aims to connect researchers across diverse disciplines both in Vancouver and Colona with the goal of advancing climate solutions more quickly. Uh I'm grateful to be sharing

So, the Climate Solutions Research Collective is an initiative that aims to connect researchers across diverse disciplines both in Vancouver and Colona with the goal of advancing climate solutions more quickly. Uh, I'm grateful to be sharing this space with you today and excited to welcome you to the panel addressing climate adaptation: preparing Vancouver's workforce for a coastal reality.

I would like to acknowledge that the Vancouver Public Library is on the unseated traditional and ancestral territories of the Musquam, Squamish, and Slaywat nations. And as stewards of these lands yesterday, today, and tomorrow, they continue to lead through

I would like to acknowledge that the Vancouver Public Library is on the unceded traditional and ancestral territories of the Musqueam, Squamish, and Tsleil-Waututh nations. And as stewards of these lands yesterday, today, and tomorrow, they continue to lead through advocacy and action for the health and future of the territory. And I would like to say a thank you for their ongoing stewardship and leadership.

Today, we've come together to explore what the tomorrow looks like for those living and working in this coastal region. We will discuss the realities of a changing coast due to climate change and what that means for people looking

Today, we've come together to explore what tomorrow looks like for those living and working in this coastal region. We will discuss the realities of a changing coast due to climate change and what that means for people looking to engage in the workforce.

have heard earlier, there are washrooms if you go outside that door. Um they're straight behind us over here.

A couple administrative details. We do have a photographer today, uh, at the event. If you do not want your photograph taken, um, you can reach out to Yenni and just please let him know. Also, you may not have heard earlier, there are washrooms if you go outside that door. Um, they're straight behind us over here.

organization that empowers fossil fuel and indigenous workers to transition into net zero careers. So, Sabrine Ajinaku, who's a sustainability program officer, and Jodi Han, who is an innovation and STEM manager, were the catalyst for this event, sharing their

I'd like to take a quick moment to thank the folks who've brought this event together. There have been quite a number of, uh, organizations involved in this panel. And so firstly, I'd like to recognize Iron and Earth, which is an organization that empowers fossil fuel and Indigenous workers to transition into net zero careers. So, Sabrine Ajinaku, who's a sustainability program officer, and Jodi Han, who is an innovation and STEM manager, were the catalyst for this event, sharing their initial concept and bringing together mentors from Iron and Earth who are on today's panel.

Uh, I'd also like to say a huge thank you to the Center for Climate Justice at UBC, a group which advances the urgent social, political, and economic changes necessary to address the climate crisis.

Uh, I'd also like to say a huge thank you to the Center for Climate Justice at UBC, a group which advances the urgent social, political, and economic changes necessary to address the climate crisis.

From coordinating panelists from UBC to outreach and advertising, he's ensured that this idea has turned into an event.

You have Yenni Matviv, a communications and events coordinator with the CCJ, who has done a huge amount of the behind-the-scenes work, uh, that is required for this kind of event, and it certainly would not have come together as it has without these contributions.

earlier. Um, they have been such a supportive uh support for this panel. Um, as well as all of the other events here today, uh, from the very get-go.

From coordinating panelists from UBC to outreach and advertising, he's ensured that this idea has turned into an event.

So, let's get to today's panel. Um I will do the introductions and then I will hand it over to our moderator. So, I'll start by introducing today's moderator who's ID Ada GMA.

So, thank you to Yenni. Of course, we'd like to say a big thank you to Vancouver Public Library, who's graciously provided the space. In particular, in particular, Candy Tanaka, who's the community event specialist at the VPL, who you met earlier. Um, they have been such a supportive, uh, support for this panel. Um, as well as all of the other events here today, uh, from the very get-go.

leader with experience designing and delivering youth engagement initiatives across the province. In her leadership role with Youth Climate Corps BC, she supports teams working on hands-on climate action projects in areas such as community resiliency, active transportation, food security, wildfire

Uh, and they've made this an extremely welcoming partnership. So, thank you. Uh, and finally, I'd like to thank all those involved with the Pacific Northwest Climate Week for creating the container that has inspired all of us to gather in community.

I will give you a very brief introduction of our three panelists um and they will be able to provide you with a bit more details about the work that they do uh within their responses to the questions today. So first we have

So, let's get to today's panel. Um, I will do the introductions and then I will hand it over to our moderator. So, I'll start by introducing today's moderator, who's Ada GMA.

infrastructure systems. Next to Amanda, we have Brunwin Warick. Brunwin is an independent sustainability consultant and entrepreneur who guides startups, small businesses, and nonprofits through baselining and planning. She is also a volunteer mentor with iron and earth.

I practice this and it's not even that hard. Ada GMA Petit. Aida A is the assistant director of programs at Youth Climate Corps British Columbia and is a mentor with Iron and Earth. Aida is a climate and community-focused program leader with experience designing and delivering youth engagement initiatives across the province. In her leadership role with Youth Climate Corps BC, she supports teams working on hands-on climate action projects in areas such as community resiliency, active transportation, food security, wildfire risk reduction, waste management, ecological restoration, and energy efficiency. Aida's work is grounded in building strong partnerships and collaboration, and we are thrilled to welcome her as today's moderator.

behind the framing of climate adaptation issues and efforts including the role of fear, nostalgia, and hope uh in how infrastructural and ecological planning policy and management practices are designed and implemented. Um, with that, just as I I'm about to pass over

I will give you a very brief introduction of our three panelists, um, and they will be able to provide you with a bit more details about the work that they do, uh, within their responses to the questions today. So first, we have Dr. Amanda Jiang, who's an associate professor at UBC within both the Institute for Resources, Environment and Sustainability and Mechanical Engineering. Her full-time academic work is centered on environmental modeling, data analytics, and policy choice. A key focus of her work is on decarbonizing infrastructure systems. Next to Amanda, we have Brunwin Warick. Brunwin is an independent sustainability consultant and entrepreneur who guides startups, small businesses, and nonprofits through baselining and planning. She is also a volunteer mentor with Iron and Earth.

you. Um, but thank you all for being here to listen to our lovely panelists this afternoon. There we go.

And next to Brunwin, we have Michael Bros. Michael is a lecturer and PhD student at the UBC School of Architecture and Landscape Architecture with 15 years professional experience practicing climate adaptation in coastal Louisiana. He's interested in researching the role of social drivers behind the framing of climate adaptation issues and efforts, including the role of fear, nostalgia, and hope, uh, in how infrastructural and ecological planning, policy, and management practices are designed and implemented. Um, with that, just as I, I'm about to pass over the mic, um, you will have an opportunity to submit questions on Slido. And in a moment, we will put the instructions up on the screen behind the panelists, but we're going to start out with, uh, questions from Aida. Over to you. Um, but thank you all for being here to listen to our lovely panelists this afternoon. There we go.

communities can become more resilient to said changes um that are ongoing across the province and across the world.

Um, climate adaptation is no longer a future conversation. It is a reality we are all living in. So, for today, I'm really excited to hear from the three of you professionals in your own career spaces to speak to that and to see how communities can become more resilient to said changes, um, that are ongoing across the province and across the world.

Um, prior to working on your PhD at UBC, you've spent the last 15-ish years working in Louisiana to help manage coastal erosion and land loss. Um, so I'm really curious, what are maybe some similarities or differences that you see

Um, and on that note, I'll kick us off right away with some questions. So from Michael, I'm going to start with you.

Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. So, um it's really hard to think of two places that are quite as different as Vancouver and New Orleans.

Um, prior to working on your PhD at UBC, you've spent the last 15-ish years working in Louisiana to help manage coastal erosion and land loss. Um, so I'm really curious, what are maybe some similarities or differences that you see here in BC and across Canada? And what can we learn as a province and in our own political systems here to adapt to said changes?

Vancouver is celebrated for its livability. So, I mean, there's a lot of similarities, too, though. Um, both are delta cities. They've got a rich convergence of cultures. Um, both have histories rooted in colonialism and racial injustices which carry through to

Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. So, um, it's really hard to think of two places that are quite as different as Vancouver and New Orleans.

don't cater to carbon intensive extractive industries like AI and oil and gas. Um, in Louisiana, Meta is building one of the world's largest data centers. Um, it's going to use about 20% of Louisiana's electricity just in that one data center. Um, they're building

Um, you got big mountains versus like a really super flat city. Um, uh, cities Vancouver is defined by its, uh, planning successes versus New Orleans kind of defined by its failures. Um, New Orleans is celebrated for its liveliness and Vancouver is celebrated for its livability. So, I mean, there's a lot of similarities, too, though. Um, both are delta cities. They've got a rich convergence of cultures. Um, both have histories rooted in colonialism and racial injustices which carry through to many of the problems that they deal with today. Um, and I think that BC can learn a lot from Louisiana, but unfortunately, I think most of the lessons are on what not to do. Um, so for instance, like don't cater to carbon intensive extractive industries like AI and oil and gas. Um, in Louisiana, Meta is building one of the world's largest data centers. Um, it's going to use about 20% of Louisiana's electricity just in that one data center. Um, they're building three new gas power plants just for that one. We've g

Um, yeah, it's it's pretty bleak and um and now it's rumored that SpaceX is looking to build a new massive spaceport in Louisiana as well. Um, but it's unknown because it's hidden behind NDAs and there's uh it's it's shrouded in

secrecy. Um and so a lot of it has to do with um I mean the this corporate welfare and the neoliberal economic policies that have you know driven this investment and this type of um of changes um have come

with uh a lot of costs for you know everyday people. Um insurance is through the roof. Um the racial wealth gap is enormous. Education is is lacking. And I I moved here to BC in Vancouver um partly because uh New Orleans and

Louisiana was such a hard place to raise a family. Um so I'm really glad to be here. Um but it's just um yeah, there's a lot of issues, but at the same time like it's it's got incredible people.

Anyway, getting back to the question about what BC can learn. Um don't fortify yourself with uh walls from water. uh don't structure climate adaptation as adversarial or militaristic relationship with nature.

Um in Louisiana, we build walls and leveies um and they're controlled by the army. Flood control uses the language and the posture of a military campaign.

Um so those are things to avoid. And there's a lot of encouraging work being done in BC with dam removal that uh and salmon restoration that is um is encouraging to see. Um and I can talk a lot more about this, but I've already

talked a lot, so I I'll let the other people talk. Yeah, no worries. Thank you for that.

Yeah, like you said very well in that, but the poly crisis is very intersectional in the ways in which we see it changing across all different sectors of work and what we need to tackle it from. So I

appreciate that answer and kind of brings me to you Amanda um and in your work. Obviously, your work spans from societal dynamics to technical engineering um and to policy related decisions that firm some of the like legal legal frameworks we take in um

enacting change within our climate and our economic spaces. Can you talk a little bit about the diverse roles that are needed to go from something that's more technical like solar and green technologies to um more like equitable implementation for BC for what we need

to see to see change actually happen? Yeah, this is a tough question. U maybe I'll start with what um I think might be challenging sometimes about transitions and and in particular making sure they're just transitions. Um, and it's

that I actually think that there there are actually at least two transitions that are happening, right? Like right now, we're trying to build up new, more climate resilient um, uh, net zero systems. And at the same time, we're

also trying to phase out some fossil dependent systems and old systems. Um, and in the middle, that means we're kind of have these two systems coexisting.

We're also trying to not just build completely new systems, but modify and retrofit our existing systems uh to be more climate resilient. Um and that's that's kind of like a a tricky space.

And um some colleagues Emily Gubert, Sarah Hastings, Simon, they call this space like the mid-t transition. Um because you know we're like we're not on either side of it yet. Um and they really point out that if we're really

not careful at this phase of the transition, it's really easy for inequitable outcomes to happen. So um inequitable access to climate resilient infrastructure or um highquality renewable energy. Um also like different groups disproportionately bearing the burden of older systems. So for instance

as we're electrifying a lot of stuff and there are fewer and fewer people on the gas system, gas gets more and more expensive and often the last people who are on the gas system might be uh for instance tenants who didn't have the

option to electrify. And so they really point out that like this transition phase is really tricky. Um and so it requires a lot of coordination and care.

And so that makes me think of the like ecosystem of roles that we really need.

I think during the transition I think there's so many different you know things that we do. We need people to motivate and inspire action to build consensus. Um but we also really need people on that planning and coordination

side. uh because again like if we just let these transitions kind of happen without care and we're not paying attention to the details about the sequencing or who is bearing the burdens um it's really possible I think for this

to to not be just and I think that also really has a lot of implications for people who are like at the front lines of implementation. So like I think about the person who you're trying to find to

install a heat pump in in your home or the mechanic that you're going to for your car. Um, I think it like this mid mid-t transition requires like a lot of flexibility from people in these roles because again it's like you might have

someone coming in with an electric car. You might have someone coming in with, you know, like a diesel engine. Uh, you might be trying to install a heat pump in a home that wasn't was never designed to have the electrical system for for

something like this. So, um, I I think um like those two roles I think are something that are really important for for just transitioning.

Yeah, absolutely. not only like on an individual level but a more systemic level as well for that transition.

Totally. Um Bronwin, this kind of pushes me over to you because you work more with uh like on the business side of things with um small nonprofits and small businesses around sustainability and sustainability and consulting and planning. Um,

what specific roles or skills or operational capacity do you do you see that is needed to build better systems for this like mid-transition that Amanda was just speaking to?

Yeah, that's a really really great question and um I'll also just expand a little bit. I've I've I've bounced around a lot in my career. where I started my sustainability career at Stantech, which is a large engineering and architecture firm. And then I

operated a small consulting business and now I kind of anything from working with startups to small businesses and small communities. Um, and then I do some work with the Canadian Society for Civil Engineering and Envision Canada and Envisions a Sustainable Infrastructure

Framework that maybe I'll get into later. If not, we can chat about. But I just wanted to add that because I guess I've kind of seen small, medium, large.

And I think um when it comes to capacity, the thing that I thing I really see in my work as a consultant now being on so many different sides of things is is really an operational capacity gap. Like

the skills are there and people are constantly upskilling. Like it's actually pretty incredible. I feel like I can like, you know, take a break from something for a couple of months. Maybe I'm not on a project that is about that

and then all of a sudden I'm like, "Wow, we've already we've already there's been so much innovation." But I think it's really about as you mentioned Amanda putting the putting the pieces together in the right way and being strategic

because every organization has different needs and then our system has needs and it's like matching those pieces. So we work as you said as as an ecosystem like a lot of what you said resonated and it's integrated. I think one of our

biggest challenges is that historically, especially in a capitalist system, things have been very siloed, right?

Like everybody's profits and goals are separate. But when it comes to sustainability, transparency and collaboration is really key. So an operational capacity gap is, I think, less about okay, let's go into our corner and figure out what we need to do

so that we can have the best skills and do it the best and maybe more about how we can work together. Um some of my work recently I've been working with the climate ready infrastructure service um which is uh f federal funding to help

small communities look at climate resilience climate and sustainability resilience on infrastructure projects. So communities like 30,000 and under.

And the first thing is really just like where do we start, right? There's so many different things that you can do.

Um but looking strategically at things, there's also a lot of funding. There's also a lot of um people wanting to do this work. There's a lot of pairing and strategic matches that can be done. So, it's not always about getting, you know,

all of the skills internally. I think it's about how we work together as kind of a system and an yeah, an organism, I guess. So, I always push a lot for transparency. I've worked with people in the past that have a lot of walls up and

I'm like, "Hey, we're we're doing sustainability work here." Like, what why are we doing what we're doing?

Right? and kind of going back to the values of that. So yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Community and understanding that climate action and climate like climate resiliency has to do with sharing resources and approaching it as a unit together to

tackle those inequities. Um, something that comes to my brain and I'm curious for the all of you thinking about tackling these inequities. A big piece of my work is working with youth to do that work to pay them a living wage to

do work with youth and um there's so many solutions like you said out there and and technical skills that need to be done. So I'm curious for all of you like what are ways in which you think young

workers can maybe start to attack these inequities or this imbalance that you see in this this mid transition period.

Start. Sure. Um, yeah, that is a that is a that is a tough question to to be honest.

Like there's both so much to do and um so many different ways to tackle it. I think um I I feel like when it comes to young folks getting involved, I've done, you know, we all do mentorship with with

Iron and Earth. So talking to people, it's like the passion is there. Like I've no question about the passion from I mean I think that there's actually I'm taking a step back there's a lot of passion there's also a lot of nihilism

like we're dealing with a time where you can also feel quite despondent and like what am I going to do but I do feel like the passion is there and I think it's about like using that as a catalyst and a champion.

So um I feel like one thing that can be done especially with younger folks who are entering or wanting to enter is this these industries is really trying to bring kind of a new and problem solving mindset because sustainability also

sustainability and climate resilience and adaptation it also isn't a new thing right so we are also in this time and transition time kind of that you mentioned where we have we are in this mid-transition and there have been folks

that have been in these industries working for a long time um I feel like bringing fresh and new ideas in a way that maybe folks haven't thought about things. I think the challenge there is like are people ready for that? Like are

folks who are in their mid and later career especially I see this sometimes in like consulting and engineering like are they ready to hear those things? So it's like how do you create a communication gap between the thing the

way things have been done and ways that can even push things in a more innovative way. So I'm not 100% sure I have the answer to that but that's like that's kind of the gap I have. So yeah.

Yeah, it's a hard question because um the so many of these issues are um you know it's an issue of scale where the um you know there's not much agency that we have as individuals to affect change at

a you know institutional or um you know within you know a large capitalist system where corporations have so much power and I think to put um the burden of change onto the individual is is a little problematic and something that we

need to unlearn. So like you know we're not going to solve this by recycling but it's still a good thing to recycle. You know it's like and so holding those two things together I think is challenging and I think that's one of the things

that I see in um some a lot of the students that I I I work with. Um yeah, and to to make sure that they have the the self-worth that to value themselves and to um imagine a new future, but to

also enact that future um right now, you know, to really focus on the process, not the results. and to kind of be, you know, here now, you know, and that sustainability or resilience is not something far off from the future that

we can achieve, but it's it's how we relate to each other and how we um how we we are maybe I'll just build on threads from from uh both Bronin and Michael just to say that I think it is a super exciting

opportunity right now to reimagine and particularly ly with like new systems and new ways of doing and especially like young industry sectors like we haven't been doing some of these things before you know kind of like thinking about some of the new needs for coastal

resilience and adaptation and that means actually I think there's um space a lot there's sometimes more space for new ideas like when you know we're starting something fresh and I think one of the exciting things about those new ideas

too is that it's not just about like technologies or designs But like the the operating models, the business models, the non-b businessiness models, the um ways of doing too where there can be a lot of innovation. And I think that like

I think for those of us who've grown up in one way of doing, it's really hard to imagine different things like like then that's why you get so many things that are just about substitution where it's like everything's the same but like this

is now electrified or something like that. and um you know getting to like be an educator and um you know working with with young people I I'm just always so blown away, right? Because they come up with things that I never could have

imagined because I've always been in in the system. And so um just yeah like really encourage like younger younger folks, younger workers to like like bring those creative ideas um about like the the like hard infrastructure but also all the soft infrastructure too. Um

and that um yeah that that's an exciting opportunity. Yeah, I think that's some of the beauty of intergenerational work is you get the wisdom of our older generation of people and the passion from our new to combine to create something um that hopefully

tackles these this poly crisis in a way. I think this makes me it pings a question for me about a big worry that I see amongst youth and maybe you see this question coming but um and the automation of the workforce and leaning

into uh like a green sector and a new career and the worry that AI is going to take away this space or it's going to completely transition their career into something else. So yeah, I'm really curious like what do you think about AI

and how you can use AI to build resilient futures and uh climate resilient communities?

I I'll start I'll try. This is a tough question. Um yeah, I mean this is a huge question right now and um I I think some of the ways that especially like I work at a university, we're thinking a lot

about AI and what does AI replace, what does it not replace and I think one of the things that um we've been thinking about too is like not necessarily about like jobs as a whole, but like how does

AI support certain tasks and there are some tasks for which like maybe AI is like a really good assist for and then there are also other tasks where it's not. Um and a lot of those definitely have to do with relational aspects for

instance. So um you know what does it mean to work in a team or build consensus or do values-based decision- making? Um I think AI can be a tool that as like an input into some of these processes but we still um you know uh at

the university for instance like you know we're really thinking about like how do we how do we um support the learning of folks of how to work with these tools but still like really have that human accountability and like

ethical reasoning and critical thinking as part of the loop but maybe work with with these tools. And um I I think that's like also like a common thread in like sustainability work or climate work that like care ethic and that relational

ethic. And I think that's something that like um won't be replaced. And if anything actually gets harder I think maybe or like we have to think more about in the context of like a world with AI.

Yeah. So the best analogy that I've heard is that AI is like as bestus.

It's um you know this wonder material that was sold to everyone and put in everything and um and then we oops we discovered it's um causes cancer. It's toxic and um I think we're at that moment right now where it's being

injected in everything but it's there's a lot of harm that is either known or predicted um but is still we're still trying to develop the vocabulary and the language to really talk about it. Um, two of the the words that are the terms

that kind of stuck with me when I heard them are cognitive surrender and cognitive sovereignty.

The idea that um when you use AI you you know for decision making for um you know research that you are becoming dependent upon it and that you lose your capacity um to to think critically and freely.

Um, and you it's it's scary, but it's yeah, I think that for the most part, we need to resist it, but that's not saying that there are not um cases for it. I think especially when when the realm of

modeling and meteorology and science, you know, things that are not like um you know, the humanities essentially. Um yeah.

That was a great great analogy. I may have to steal that at some point. Um that Yeah I it's it's one of those things that's somewhat unavoidable right now, too.

It's like you try to do a Google search and it's it's AI, right? So that we're also navigating this thing where I mean some people are staunchly resisting it.

And honestly, like I think big props to folks that are doing that. And I think that like we have a huge range. We have people I know people that I would have considered a couple years ago to have

pretty similar values using AI all day and some that are completely resisting it, which is confusing, right? I think we're dealing with a little bit of like a values crisis with AI. Um, personally like I've tried to use it for

some of my sustainability work at different times and at the end of the day I always have to review things in detail. There are so many errors and it's just nothing can replace the experience that I have specifically with

problem solving and some of the frameworks that I work with. Like you would think that even putting a framework into I mean maybe I'm just not that good at it either but um maybe putting a framework into um AI could

help but there's just this nuance of problem solving like I'm the one who talked to the different people on the project or I'm the one that like has had this experience on another project that's learned something and yes I AI

should be learning from everything and everyone but you don't get that it's just the human experience is not there.

if I heard a tone in somebody's voice that they were really worried about this one part of the project or um you know this is something that a local community brought up that maybe hasn't been written down and isn't going to be in

the search model. It's like there's just so much detail that can be lost and so much overgeneralization of something like sustainability and re resilience that really can't be overgeneralized because we need to look at both local and global perspectives very cautiously

when we do this work, right? like there's such specific knowledge that needs to be specific local knowledge that needs to be taken into account. So just proceed with caution.

Yeah. Yeah. If there's any um silver lining to the whole, you know, AI thing that's going on right now is that um I think it's drawing attention to the processes of how things actually get done and it's drawing attention maybe away from the

end result. Um because AI can produce these shiny results but it totally glosses over like the messiness the hard work that goes into the process to you know achieve those results and that's where learning and you know struggle

happens and that's okay and change but like so if anyone here is working on a portfolio for architecture or design or something I think it's important to include process drawings you know show the sketches show the work that you've

done to um you how you think. It's about how you work, not necessarily the result. And so maybe that's a silver lining that's that's come out of all this or may come out of this.

Yeah, absolutely. I really want to highlight the words proceed with caution. I think that or talk talk to other people. It just reminded me of what we were talking about at the beginning like talk to other people, not just a computer. Like

look at this room of people. like there's probably so much understanding and experience in just this room alone.

So yeah, absolutely. People first. Um well, thank you so much for your answers on all of those lovely questions. I want to give some opportunity for us to answer some of the questions that you sent into that link

um to address any questions that maybe come up in the crowd tonight. Um, so for the first one I have to offer from anonymous. What advice would you give a high school student choosing their future path?

Sure. Um, I would say like volunteer, you know, put yourself out there, really talk to people. um like there's so many um different paths that are available that are um you don't even know about um until you you know unravel those threads like I

you know wanted to be an engineer when I was in college and I realized that that was not the path that I wanted to go in because I don't want to make you know a car faster just for making making a car

faster I wanted to be connected to people and so I you know got into environmental science And that led me to shorebirds, which led me to the Deep Water Horizon oil spill, which then led me to oil field remediation work. But

then I got burnt out doing that because it was all analytical and it fed into a legal system where um you know, a landowner got a fat check and there's a settlement. But then, you know, the oil company got off without having to do

remediation. And um I wanted to figure out, okay, how can I actually affect change or imagine new relations? And so that turned me on to landscape architecture. And so, you know, you you never know where you're going to go. And

you know, I even within landscape architecture, I didn't take a traditional path. And um ended up working for a nonprofit doing advocacy related work. So you you just never know, but you don't you don't know until you put yourself out there. So I think

one way to do it is to volunteer for organizations that you feel like um you're aligned with their mission.

I'll just make a quick note. Apparently the QR uh code link is broken, but if you go to slido.com and put in climate adaptation in the hashtag section, then you can submit questions. Thank you.

Um yeah, I just that's funny. I was writing put yourself out there as you were saying like right before you were saying that. But another thing is just and maybe this is my own personal experience. I've been quite

entrepreneurial throughout my entire career which I guess is also putting yourself out there and not being confined to a box. like my my undergrad was in the social sciences and after I graduated I was like I don't know what

to do with myself. I don't know if I want to go back into academia and then my I have an MBA. So I ended up going back to school and getting a business degree which was which has been super

valuable because I have these skills that kind of apply to a lot of the way that the world works. And I made this commitment. I was very I had a I had a values crisis when I went to go get my

MBA. I was like I I'm going to get a business degree. I'm going to be I was worried I was going to be surrounded with a lot of people that maybe didn't share the same values as me. And anyway,

I made a commitment to myself to um do good within those structures and systems. So like learn the structure and the systems, operate within them in a strategic way. Once you kind of get the lay of the land of something, whether

it's like yeah within an organization or whatever, then I think you can act quite um strategically, creatively and entrepreneurally.

Um, so, um, I guess going back to the high school student, I would say don't be afraid to also get traditionally traditionally helpful skills because you can still be really strategic with those skills and you can still do really

valuable stuff. You don't have to go so specific and so niche like I know a little bit about a lot of things and that's really been valuable in my career. So, um, we do exist in a system for better or for worse. So un

understanding what that system is is really helpful to be able to change it just resonate with like both these responses so much also as like a I'm still an engineer but also you know like explore some other paths and um I think

maybe like um along with that like like learning what you can from the the places that that that you're in also recognizing that like it's possible that not the one thing might not be everything right like you choose a

program in university or you take a job and it might not be that that ticks all of your boxes. It might tick some but then maybe there's something else that you do like some organizing or volunteer work or something else that allows you

to like develop the experiences you want. Um because I do think there can be some anxiety about like finding like the perfect path that like reflects all of your values and things you want to learn. And it's just sometime it's just

sometimes hard. it doesn't always exist and sometimes we build it you build it yourself through the diverse experiences that you can have.

Yeah, that's great advice. I think the one piece of advice I would also personally offer is that a climate career does not define itself by what society thinks a climate career is.

Climate careers are in all spaces as long as you focus your energy and you reframe your work to be a climate career. Um there's thousands of climate careers and climate or like green related careers. So don't forget to try

them all in the different sectors of whatever that looks like. Yeah. Um following up with another question.

What is one thing that surprised you in your work? Um I feel like uh yeah, I just said I wasn't speaking to the mic. I said I feel like I'm constantly being surprised. Um, I think in relation to

what we're talking about today with climate adaptation and resilience is I am constantly surprised by how ignorant people can be and how uneducated people can be on sustainability and resilience. I still end up in calls where and I and I and I

often say that 50% of my job is education even though that's not what if you look at my resume that's not what I'm paid to do. I'm a I'm a consultant on sometimes on pretty specialized specific engineering and architecture

projects. But um I think that I when I say ignorance, I don't want it to only be a negative thing, but there's actually an opportunity there. And with some patience, um you really can uh get through to people if you figure out what you know,

climate adaptation resilience sustainability like how that can value that um where the value is for that one person. So, I think something that's always surprised me in my career is how you can how you can weave um value into

um how you present something to someone. Sorry, that wasn't super clear. But I guess what I mean is like you you have an opportunity to um kind of sell I hate to say that way, but like sell sustainability and resilience to other

people. Like if I'm talking to you know executive folks, they might be most focused on risk management and money, right? like, you know, reputational risk and money that you can still find ways for climate adaptation to be something that saves

money and in the long term investing in the future and stuff like that. You can present something to people that are on the ground and make it exciting about what they're doing. So, I think something that surprised me is like one

the ignorance and education gap and then two, the opportunity to be able to like connect that gap and it not be just like a oh, I don't agree. Well, you don't get it, so I'm just going to walk away from

this. Like, there is really an opportunity there. Sure. Um, yeah. One thing that surprised me in this work, um, is all of the assumptions that are kind of baked into the terminology that we use that we don't necessarily, um, always question

or think about. And one word in particular is resilience. I mean, you know, we think we use it all the time.

that's used on this panel and this, you know, we've said it I don't know how many times so far. Um, but resilience means so many different things to different people and it's important to kind of unpack that and to really be

critical of like what it is we actually are talking about when we say words like resilience or sustainability because it's easy for those to just become buzzwords and lose their meaning or to have meaning that we assume everyone

else is on the same page as us, but we're actually talking about different things. And so for example like a psychologist might think of resilience as um a person's you know flexibility um you know how to change their behavior,

how to change their you know emotional state versus I'm sorry I'm going to harp on an engineer again. Um an engineer might think of resilience as a systems ability to withstand change um to resist change like you know a steel beam or a

concrete structure. um or an ecologist might think of resilience as an ecosystem's ability to um to adapt and maintain its identity.

And so I just it's important to really to question our assumptions when we use terms and to not just assume that everyone knows what we're talking about.

Um constantly surprised, surprised every day. But um um the pace of change maybe is also something that like um like has surprised me both. Sometimes it feels like things are moving so glacially and then there are other times where it's

like you blink and you know things feel right quite quite different and um and that can be tricky sometimes too because it shifts our baselines sometimes when things are changing really really quickly and um here I'm just thinking in

the context of of climate and um something I work on for instance is wildfire smoke and um you know that becoming like a normal like or an expected part of of summer like in this part of the world. it like I feel like

actually you know in the span of um just like a in the time that I've been working at UBC even right in like teaching undergraduate environmental science students that this being something remarkable has already changed in terms of some of the the stu and so

um it's something that really like again on to that intergenerational point like it it makes me see the importance of intergenerational communication because our experiences of time and what's normal um is so Yeah, absolutely. The pacing of change

is very rapid and slow at the same time. Um, moving on to our next question.

People are curious. What are the techniques for communicating the need for climate resilience and sustainability actions to folks that don't interact with those in practice like in the day-to-day?

Um I think um one of the ways is is kind of just like illuminating the ways in which people's lives are actually kind of touched by by this already. So the wildfire smoke I think is is is one

example. Um I think you've been using you know you've been talking about like poly crisis and the way that so many of these systems are interacting climate change is interacting with so many other systems and crises that we're we're

experiencing now. But it's not always easy to to see that, I think, especially if that's not what you're working on all all the time. So, I think really like making those connections to people's daily daily lives. And um I will say

that like with Wildfire Smoke, I've had so many more family members like call me to talk. Like most of the time they're not very interested in the work I do, but a lot of them now they're like, "Hey, like what should we be thinking

about this or like how do we plan for this?" And um so like them seeing that connection with their daily lives, I think actually like made them a lot more more curious about it. So, it's something that maybe I feel like we

could do do more of as as opposed to talking about it in a more abstract way.

I did speak to this a little bit. I feel like actually in the previous question, which is communicating about sustainability and resilience in a way that is tailored to that specific person, whether it's their role or their specific experience. For better or for

worse, it seems to be a human condition that until we're impacted by something, we have a hard time seeing it. Um but you're but I mean I think we opened this panel by saying that that that time is

now like we are being impacted by it. So yeah reminding people um uh I also feel like in in communicating to people I really liked what you said about defining things. So like defining okay what are we actually talking about right

now if we're if we're talking about this and what does it mean to you? What does it mean to me? What does it might it mean to our communities? Um and and and the work that we're doing. Um, and

another thing I think is like personally patience and compassion. Like I know it can be hard especially if you're trying to do like advocacy work or if you're really trying to make a change to hear people have such

different perspectives but I I I actually have had a decent amount of situations where I start with somebody who is quite um negative about or kind of non-believing and in time through using case studies and project examples to see how there have been wins that

might be not specifically related to um what I guess wins that are beyond what if somebody who would just care about sustainability resilience cares about um kind of to get through to people. So yeah, communication strategy there.

Yeah, this is a really good question. Um I think depending upon the context like communication is not necessarily a one-way street and it's important to focus on listening and so that you know when you're doing the work that you are

in tune with you know the people that you're working with um and that it's not just that you have this idea that you then need to project on to them but that it's more of a not just a dialogue but a

um a collaborative ative process um of working together. Yeah, absolutely. And knowing when to step away from the conversation if it's not going a functional way. It's always good to protect your own safety in that too. Um yeah,

moving on to another question that's a little bit more specific around our natural spaces in this area. other folks are curious about um career options and nature-based solutions and what it looks like specifically in Vancouver to adapt to this uh you know coastal adaptation

reality. Um I guess I I can speak a little bit to my experience working with the Envision framework for sustainable infrastructure. I don't know are folks familiar with that framework? No.

Anyone? Envision. No. Okay. Um, lead. Are people familiar with LEAD for buildings? Um, Envision is kind of like lead. It's a sustainability framework for infrastructure projects. So, horizontal projects like roads, bridges, water wastewater transportation projects, um, you know, wide range. I've done a

lot of work with like ports, airports, municipalities. So, the types of projects that you see those folks doing.

Um, Envision is a little bit less prescriptive than lead. It's more intentbased and credits cover social, environmental, economic and climate. The categories are quality of life, leadership, natural world, resource allocation and then there's a whole category on um climate and resilience.

And so going back to the question of um looking at nature-based solutions um in my work having frameworks and methodologies that have some guidance on naturebased solutions as well as once again case studies of other places that have that

have done naturebased solutions really well um is a really helpful starting point. Um I I always turn to experts in those things too. I'd be curious here maybe from like the landscape architecture side of things or some of

the um research that's been done on coastal communities specifically um what could be done but I um one thing that I'm I've seen on a couple projects that's really exciting and I think you brought it up actually is like the

daylighting of creeks. So, um restoration of creeks where there's salmon have I was on a there was a project at BCIT um which was um a daylighting of Gishon Creek and now the salmon are flowing up that uh river

again um and it's that's a pretty incredible thing to see and it actually happened in like half the amount of time that they expected them to come back. So like nature is really resilient. Um there's a there's a credit in in in

vision there there's the climate resilience category has a section on emissions so mitigation and then a section on resilience and adaptation and there's the last it kind of builds on itself. So you do a bit of a uh you

assess climate change vulnerability, you evaluate the risk and resilience, you establish goals and strategies and then you come up with ways to uh see if you've maximized resilience in those ways. And um then there's a final credit which is about infrastructure

integration. And I feel like that really focuses on those nature-based solutions. So I guess I've talked a little bit more about a framework. Obviously there's so many different context specific naturebased solutions, but there are some really great frameworks out there

for looking at those things. And if folks want to connect more on Envision or nature based or envision, I don't want to talk about it in too much detail, but there um I have a lot more information on it. If it's a framework

you're curious about and actually doing an training to become an ENVSP, helping coordinate that later this fall. So, if anyone has any questions, let me know.

Well, uh, I'm a relative newcomer to this area, so I I don't have too many examples of specific, you know, jobs that I think the person asking is looking for. Um, but I would like to talk a little bit about naturebased

solutions. Absolutely. Um, I don't know, it's I'm going to get pedantic here, so sorry.

Um, nature-based solutions is an interesting concept. Um, and I just want to break it down for a minute. Same thing that we did with resilience. um what are we talking about like nature nature is a social construct it's um you

know we don't have the same ideas of what nature is um in many indigenous first nations do not even you not have a word for nature because there was no division between nature and society and so when we adopt a framework like

nature-based solutions we are um at risk of perpetuating that divide between nature and society to say that nature is over there and society is over here. So it's okay to do um extractive um exploitative processes here but the

nature part over there is protected and gets into the ecomodernism and this idea of um yeah of just this uh future that is still operating with these colonial um models. So, uh, again, I'm getting pedantic, getting into theory a little

bit. Um, and then also the idea of solutions that there is like a finite, you know, um, moment where we could put up a banner that says mission accomplished and, you know, and call it a day. It's more about the process. It's

about how we relate to our to each other and to the landscape. Um, and so that's my my soap box about nature-based solutions.

Okay. Lovely. Thank you. Um and I'll end us on this final question from the audience and then we'll close us out.

But the last question from the audience is what is the role of professional associations or industry associations in supporting members to prepare for climate realities?

um definitely an important role to to play in terms of like like really supporting that lifelong learning that we we need to um as these industries change. I think like gone are the days of like set it and forget it or like you

learn something like 20 years ago and then you can continue operating that way. And I think professional societies are really important. I say I was thinking about this because I just did my professional engineering uh um continuing education recently, but I

think it's really really important because I I think um there's a lot of learning that we need to do because a like the world that the world is changing really really quickly and Broadin was earlier talking about like

all the like upskilling that people are are doing. I think professional societies can play a really important role in terms of like making sure that that's happening and that standards are are changing and being updated and that also the like broader range of skills

that I think we've identified um are part of people's professional identities like um working towards reconciliation is an important part of being an engineer as is planning for uncertainty and climate change and some of these things weren't considered part of the

engineering profession for instance you know 50 50 years ago 60 years ago so um I I do think that there's like a powerful role that these associations can can play in terms of like really highlighting um uh the yeah lifelong

learning. Yeah, that's great. Um I am not an engineer but have worked with engineers a lot and work with the Canadian Society for Civil Engineering. Um and what I have I guess so I guess I could be more

of an observation. I've been to a handful of conferences is that there's an opportunity for people to share really specific academic research and have people in industry get excited about it. And then there's also an opportunity for kind of um

uh capacity building and like knowledge dissemination in those spaces because you can have so many people that are doing the same type of work but maybe not well some type of umbrella work but maybe not the exact same way can learn

from each other. Um so I would say the opportunities to educate connect and um learn from from each other. Um but I am I guess not I mean I have some credentials associated with sustainability frameworks but I'm not

part of a specific um professional organization in that way. Um so yeah designation I don't know if you have anything you want to add.

Yeah, I think professional organizations um they right now they have a major role and I'd like to see them have more of a role with um with AI, right? And um one of the things that AI has um been

changing is it's a lot harder for recent graduates to get internships um because a lot of the jobs that were being done by interns are now being done by AI. And um I think that is going to start

eroding the professional pipeline of people you know going into these careers. And so it's I see it as a responsibility of these professional organizations take a stance in order to ensure that those internships, those opportunities are available for recent

graduates um to you know become the engineers or the landscape architects of the future.

Lovely. Thank you. Well, I just wanted to say thank you so much for spending the afternoon with us to speak on climate adaptation in a coastal reality and sharing your expect expertise and all of the audience's lovely questions.

Um, please come find them if you have any follow-up questions after this. And thank you so much for spending some time with us this afternoon.