Speaker A
It's one of the great unfair moments in sports history. Good luck. May the best man and the best team win.
Unseen interview with Toto Wolff on leadership, trauma, and Mercedes' F1 success.
Key Takeaways
- Leadership requires authenticity and consistency in actions and words.
- Personal trauma and adversity can fuel ambition and resilience.
- Success in Formula 1 is a combination of talent, hard work, support, and luck.
- Managing a large team demands high standards and adaptability.
- Mental health awareness is crucial even in high-pressure environments like F1.
Summary
- Toto Wolff reflects on unfair moments in sports, particularly the Hungarian Grand Prix.
- He discusses his leadership style, emphasizing authenticity and sticking to one's word.
- Wolff shares personal experiences of trauma, including his father's brain cancer and financial struggles in childhood.
- He highlights how humiliation and adversity shaped his ambition and eagerness to succeed.
- The interview covers Wolff's late start in motorsport and his journey through various careers before joining Mercedes.
- He stresses the importance of talent meeting hard work, ambition, enthusiasm, and luck.
- Wolff talks about the challenges of managing a large team and maintaining high standards.
- Mental health and coping with stress are addressed as important factors in his leadership.
- He reflects on the organizational strengths of Mercedes and the need for succession planning.
- The interview provides insights into Wolff’s mindset, resilience, and vision for the future of Mercedes in Formula 1.
Chapters
- 00:00Introduction and Unfair Moments in Sports
- 02:53Impact of Trauma and Ambition
- 05:27Father's Illness and Personal Impact
- 08:02Early Identity and Motorsport Beginnings
- 10:56Childhood Humiliation and Financial Struggles
- 13:33Career Path and Mindset Development
- 18:51Leadership Philosophy and Team Management
- 23:03Mental Health and Stress Management
- 24:45Organizational Strengths and Future Planning
Full Transcript — Download SRT & Markdown
Speaker A
can't hide it uh there is no thinking about it did I do that right now did I show too much emotion or not I'm just being myself trying to be myself it's the Hungarian Grand Prix for the eighth
Speaker A
Exactly, and that race was unfair. Sometimes the headphones break, and when I see that, I'm not proud, but it's just who I am.
Speaker A
came here how proud are you of what you and your team have achieved in that period of time I think the word proud doesn't do it doesn't do it enough Justice because uh we came here with the aim to be competitive to win races maybe
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I can't hide it. There is no thinking about it. Did I do that right now? Did I show too much emotion or not? I'm just being myself, trying to be myself.
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you've done because you know reality is going to catch you up eventually and the loss is just just a weekend away those leadership qualities that you have and you show were you born with those can you learn to become a leader where
Speaker A
It's the Hungarian Grand Prix for the eighth time for Lewis Hamilton. The only thing you can do to make it work is actually do what you mean and stick to your word. There is no other way.
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believe that there were many effects in my life humiliation and Trauma that were beneficial for my later career I'd rather not had them but um so it's a mix in my opinion Talent needs to meet hard work ambition enthusiasm particularly
Speaker A
So here we are, sat at Mercedes nearly a decade on from when you first came here. How proud are you of what you and your team have achieved in that period of time?
Speaker A
an impact did it have on you then and has it had on you for the rest of your life it has an impact um until today because since I can remember my father was Ill with the brain cancer um and he
Speaker A
I think the word proud doesn't do it enough justice because we came here with the aim to be competitive, to win races, maybe fight for a championship, but never would we have expected to win eight consecutive World Championships.
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that certainly is part of how I am today with um all the bad sides that come with it the trauma but also on the other side I think ambition and eagerness to to do well talk about humiliation your mom had to
Speaker A
So I need to pinch myself every day, but it's always a risk when you're a little bit too proud of what you've done because reality is going to catch you up eventually, and the loss is just a weekend away.
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trying to look after people and put that right so that situation was was stretch for because if you are raised in an underprivileged background but everybody around you is of the same of the same group that I think it's easier to cope
Speaker A
Those leadership qualities that you have and you show, were you born with those? Can you learn to become a leader? Where did you get yours from?
Speaker A
that had a lot um uh in terms of financial means and we didn't and there was a stage that the school fees couldn't be paid and I know that we got reminders but one day in school after lunch break a person
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I think there is a certain genetic predisposition that you have. You are good at things and bad at others. You have a certain degree of talent, but there is a big influence obviously through your childhood, and I believe that there were many effects in my life, humiliation and trauma, that were beneficial for my later career.
Speaker A
exactly and she sat there already not knowing what was going on and the head Master said um school fees are not paid you you need to pack your bags and go home and I had to go back to class um
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I'd rather not have had them, but so it's a mix in my opinion. Talent needs to meet hard work, ambition, enthusiasm, particularly with children and teenagers that grow up with the right support network, and then a big portion of luck.
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and I had to explain to her what happened without actually causing too much emotional damage and I remember that moment it sits so deep when that happens to you and many others that were similar um that uh very very much part
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That trauma you talk about, in your case, was your dad passing away. You were 15 at the time. How much of an impact did it have on you then, and has it had on you for the rest of your life?
Speaker A
you describe yourself as a driver it was interesting that when I got in touch with motorsport for the first time it was pretty late it was when I was 18 and this is when I found my identity literally the first time I
Speaker A
It has an impact until today because since I can remember, my father was ill with brain cancer, and he suffered from it for 10 years and then eventually died when I was 15.
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and eventually enjoyed quite a successful few years in in junior single seaters and in 1994 when I was 22 Sena died in IMA and an Austrian renberger and at that stage my sponsors the few that I had um that I organized myself
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That is a time where as a boy you need a father. That wasn't the case with me. We were in financially difficult circumstances. That didn't help either.
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successful I came back as a GT driver uh with a lot of ambition trying to show that I was still able to race with the pros I did a lot of rallying with um with success and um and that's why I
Speaker A
So that certainly is part of how I am today with all the bad sides that come with it, the trauma, but also on the other side, I think ambition and eagerness to do well.
Speaker A
Mercedes I just want to talk about that in between period and not so much what job you went from one to the other but more your mindset a lot of people have their hopes Dash their dreams don't become cricketers racing drivers they
Speaker A
Talk about humiliation. Your mom had to scrape and save to try and get you to a public school, and at times she couldn't pay the bills, and you were literally dragged out, you and your sister, out of those classes.
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when you have an ambition if you have this desire to be in a certain sport or in a certain activity it's always going to break out and it's always going to bring you there I remember that when I had to start to
Speaker A
How much did that humiliation affect you, and you always constantly trying to look after people and put that right?
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Investment Banking then eventually had my own Investment Company benefiting from the stock markets um and the tech bubble in the in in the 2000s then I went into rling bought the team eventually bought the touring car team with Mercedes because we managed
Speaker A
So that situation was a stretch because if you are raised in an underprivileged background but everybody around you is of the same group, I think it's easier to cope because as a child you're not seeing that it can be very different.
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that open opened when they were completely unexpected but it brought me back to what I identified as uh who I was uh at the age of 18 and um I believe very much that there is a past that is that is
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My mother really stretched herself financially in order to keep us in a private school in Vienna, so every day we were confronted with children that had a lot in terms of financial means, and we didn't.
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wonder Ross Brawn is shaking his head that path takes you here Mercedes age 39 did you know before you walk through the door what needed changing or did that take time it started with let's say the the the with common sense what did I
Speaker A
There was a stage that the school fees couldn't be paid, and I know that we got reminders, but one day in school after lunch break, a person from the director's office, headmaster's office, came in and said, "Can you please come with me?"
Speaker A
it was completely natural I walked in here first time in reception and I knew what I wanted to do you also saw used coffee cups an old Daily Mail how does that affect the Formula 1 team it is the
Speaker A
And I went. I was called to the headmaster's office. My sister was there. She must have been around 10 years old. I don't remember exactly, and she sat there already not knowing what was going on.
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1 reception there was an old Daily Mail that was in many pieces on a table and an old coffee cup with dried coffee inside and when I went up to the meeting I said doesn't feel like a Formula One
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The headmaster said, "School fees are not paid. You need to pack your bags and go home."
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excellence and that starts with um cleaniness and an Immaculate environment particularly in Formula One and I remember reading about Steve Jobs who said the the iPhone needs to be as clean inside as it is outside and this is very
Speaker A
I had to go back to class and pick my stuff, and obviously, my stupid friends were like, "Great, you can go home."
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enjoying the journey and the process but I'm different this is a results oriented business the stopwatch never lies almost never and um you know whether you've been good enough or not and so I try to reverse engineering reverse engineer
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But that was a really bad moment, and then we had a 45-minute tram journey back home, my sister and I, and I had to explain to her what happened without actually causing too much emotional damage.
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a reverse engineer from there what do we need to do in order to achieve that success and um that has proven to be successful until now you need the people what do you look for when you're hiring people at Mercedes what do you look for
Speaker A
I remember that moment. It sits so deep when that happens to you and many others that were similar. That was very much part of my upbringing.
Speaker A
if you have from the so same social background you dress similarly you talk um the same language but we are actually trying to find people that are compliment complimentary to us um but it is the personality I think there are key
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There's two sides to you. There's the business side and obviously the Formula One, the driving side. Let's start with the driving side. You did drive. What sort of driver, what quality of driver, how would you describe yourself as a driver?
Speaker A
together um character and competence is what makes uh the ideal candidate for us obviously in engineering it's not just personality that's going to uh get you the job but it's also what you've learned your academic background or the
Speaker A
It was interesting that when I got in touch with motorsport for the first time, it was pretty late. It was when I was 18, and this is when I found my identity. Literally the first time I saw a racing car going around circles, I knew this is what I wanted to do.
Speaker A
you and says nice words as if to say Toto we've heard all this before mate first um townold here in Mercedes with Ross who introduced me and I was what I was saying to the to to everyone was
Speaker A
But coming late to the party, missing out on go-karting was always a challenge. There wasn't a parent or support network. I had to raise the money myself.
Speaker A
guy from the shop floor that stopped and said nice words we've heard that before so the only thing how you can make it work is actually prove that you do what you mean and that you stick to your word um there
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Eventually, I enjoyed quite a successful few years in junior single-seaters, and in 1994, when I was 22, Senna died in Imola, and an Austrian, Renberger, and at that stage, my sponsors, the few that I had that I organized myself, said we don't want to do this anymore.
Speaker A
important in in our business to do it right first time or at least try to aim for that and that's why we need an organization where the 2,000 people that we have who have a part in their hand
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And this is literally when my racing career ended from one day to the other. But I forgot about racing, didn't watch any motorsport, but 10 years later, when my business life was more successful, I came back as a GT driver with a lot of ambition, trying to show that I was still able to race with the pros.
Speaker A
it you see it then say it and then it can be fixed and I think you need to create that organization and that empowerment with it the team within the team that people dare to speak up and it's what I always encourage that you
Speaker A
I did a lot of rallying with success, and that's why I think for my current job that's very important because I've been there with hundreds of races and hundreds of rallies, so I think it's beneficial for my role.
Speaker A
you're admitting a mistake and often when you make when you admit a mistake you might be dragging someone else into it as well how open are these admissions of error first of all you need to create a safe environment if somebody is scared
Speaker A
You end up working, you go and work in a bank, and then you end up here in Mercedes. I just want to talk about that in-between period and not so much what job you went from one to the other, but more your mindset.
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that's going to trickle down in the organization that you can do that and I am the first one it needs to start with the leadership I'm the first one to admit my shortcomings um in our group sessions in
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A lot of people have their hopes, their dreams, don't become cricketers, racing drivers. They have to fall back on something else. That period from being in a bank to ending up here in Mercedes, how were you pushing yourself? What was your mindset to get the big job at the end?
Speaker A
throwing someone under the bus um if you say I think we got that wrong because it's tough love the love bit is we have the same objective we want to win Formula 1 World Championship so as long as everybody's aligned behind that um
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I believe when you have an ambition, if you have this desire to be in a certain sport or in a certain activity, it's always going to break out, and it's always going to bring you there.
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mistakes when does the boss tap you on the shoulder and say you enough's enough we got to move on how do you know that line so it's super important to have responsibility and accountability and for every person to understand that she
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I remember that when I had to start to work, it was in the bank. I was sitting in a quiet moment, and I thought, one day I want to be in Formula 1 on the management side.
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acknowledge that there will be a certain percentage with our population that's not going to meet the performance criteria long over the long term and sometimes you need to take the tough tough [Music] decisions you start to call your team
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And through this funny path of life, I went into investment banking, then eventually had my own investment company benefiting from the stock markets and the tech bubble in the 2000s.
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professional is that tribe and if somebody tries to do bad then it's my full force then I'm going to give it to protect the team one of the things you have to protect obviously is mental health in Formula 1 you're looking for that
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Then I went into racing, bought the team, eventually bought the touring car team with Mercedes because we managed drivers together. It was literally a sequence of events.
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many years ago we we worked with a with a doctor uh and we looked at the various aspects of stress so one of the the things we looked at was heart rate variability that shows you how well you
Speaker A
Then Frank Williams gave me the opportunity to buy some shares from him, and then Mercedes. So in a way, when I look at it, it's a funny coincidence of things, doors that opened when they were completely unexpected, but it brought me back to what I identified as who I was at the age of 18.
Speaker A
to the slightest degree and that's how we started to have a holistic view on on people's performances overstretching people leading them to burnout is U is is something that is detrimental quickly and I'll give you one example we have a
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And I believe very much that there is a past that is there for us. We just need to keep our eyes open and not stop dreaming.
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the eagerness and the drive but we need to sometimes protect um our people um in the short term in order to make it a sustainable long-term success what about yourself and your mental health because you're soaking up the pressure of
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Michael Schumacher way off the pace, only 17th fastest. His teammate Nico Rosberg 13th fastest. Four from Mercedes. Neither car into Q3. No wonder Ross Brawn is shaking his head.
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which me the opposite effect I've thought I was I'm still very vocal about mental health because it's something that affected me in the past but um I'm in my comfort zone when the stress is very high um I'm at risk when
Speaker A
That path takes you here, Mercedes, age 39. Did you know before you walked through the door what needed changing, or did that take time?
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suffer from it's okay because if you have that sensitivity um about you know your brain or your emotion being affected by circumstances um that's good that's a super power that means you feel things much more than others that means that
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It started with, let's say, the common sense of what I believed was an organizational structure that could be successful in Formula One. What was needed in t...
Speaker A
you have a mental health problem you go to a doctor so uh it's it's nothing else what about those that say Toto wolf mental health successful wealthy head of Mercedes I think it was your mom that said it's
Speaker A
easier to cry in a a Rolls-Royce and a Volkswagen Beetle is it easier so it's actually a good a good example because she was wrong because if you are under rolls Roy literally I'm not I'm not driving roll Roy obviously Mercedes you
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come to the conclusion that even the money didn't make things better now if someone comes from an environment where you're you're lacking the basic needs and obviously financial needs is a catastrophe um is is much worse than someone who is financially independent
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but you come to the realization with that um metaphor that money doesn't buy you any happiness and I feel it it's my duty and I've seen L Hamilton talk about it to say not everything that's that's that shines is gold uh all of us are
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humans and and it is my duty to come out out and say I'm the team principal of the Mercedes-Benz Formula 1 team we won many races and it looks to be glorious but it's actually not always and I think I want to give people
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hope that you can achieve great things while suffering in between um that that's okay Val Bas now pits for Mercedes so they brought Hamilton in and the lap later in comes V Bas and it's the half time even off yet can't get the
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right front off I enjoy your management style I enjoy the way you look after your people there's a couple of examples a 2021 tire change I think valry po us literally the tire took 36 hours to change because you had to send the car
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back here to have it you know um cut off cut off basically and you never threw the lad that was changing that tire under the bus the wheel gun has jammed and they just can't get that wheel off
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the people that are working in the organization have a lot of responsibility and everybody just tries to do the best what happens is they Shred the teeth on the wheel nut they incredibly like those wheel nuts and and
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that's it the wheel nut will not come off in that particular case you know it was a failure of the system it was not the failure of the mechanic maybe had the wrong tools maybe we had the wrong
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equipment and all that you know linked to I want to do very good just led to this catastrophic failure he is now out of this race still in the pit that is it over because of a will nut that just would not budge we
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just need to be better in training that is my conclusion and I'm never going to let any person in this organization be blamed for anything that happens out there the world championship record is equal Lewis Hamilton wins the Turkish
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Grand Prix and is a seven time champion of the world I get on to your drivers um Lewis Hamilton describe Lewis Hamilton as a person and as a Formula 1 driver first place as a Formula One driver no doubt
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um the greatest that has been the the record speak for themselves I think you realize that every decade has had their Champions and he's you know him and Tona and fjo stand out not because of their racing record only but also because of
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their personalities they're very exceptional people and that is something that I that I enjoy that I've been lucky enough to be part of the greatest Formula One driver's Journey we are on the same wavelengths and um and that's something
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that I will you know that relationship is hugely beneficial from an emotional point of view because we learn from each other but also from a professional standpoint that uh we we we work successfully with each other and for me
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it's most impressive to see his development he always wants to be a better person tomorrow than he is today and seeing that constant Thrive for affection for self-improvement is some something you wouldn't expect from uh seven time world
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champion but he's the one that's eager to even top that even be better as a human being is it fair to say that General the general rule of Genius whether it be in business or in sport they are slightly different they see
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things differently they do things differently and ends have to be handled differently very much um Sometimes the best ones are also the most complex ones I think it's just acknowledging that we're all different and I it is my
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duty to create a framework for everyone that's special in this organization and it's just not one Superstar um but it's 2,000 Superstars here that we have to create an environment that makes everybody Thrive and enjoy doing what they do and if
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we're capable to do this even with the complex ones the difficult ones the ones that don't fit in a box uh it can create um uh a great company I say you have to manage him differently leou Hamilton
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does things differently the 2018 Singapore Grand Prix I think the week before he was in Shanghai on the catwalk he turns up a couple of days late people are looking at you as if to say is this okay Louis Hamilton is a friend of mine
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and his drive to be creative uh successful in the fashion industry is something that I permitted from the beginning and because we have that pack he performs and on that particular week I remember we were sitting with the
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engineers um and he was FaceTiming me and saying can you be believe that I I'm on the catwalk in Shanghai launching my own collection with Tommy hilfinger I can't believe and thank you for letting me do this and I saw the happiness in
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his face and I knew that when he's going to come to Singapore he's going to be on it because he's in a good place but he came late and then I had a press conference and all the journalists were all over me
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saying that's not professional um to miss um the first meetings and I just smiled and then un qualifying he put out a lab that is unseen nobody could beat leis Hamilton's time and leis Hamilton for fourth record equaling time takes pole here in
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Singapore wow wow that lap felt like magic and then on Sunday he just took the lead and disappeared in the distance and was never seen it's going to be a fourth Singapore grw PR victory for M Hamilton who extends his lead in the
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driv championship and that is the moment where people stop telling me or telling him what to do and how to Le his [Applause] life for leis Hamilton it has been a dream great job everyone what a weekend that's a case of Excellent Man
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management what it leads to though is other people are coming up to you and saying well you let Lewis do that you let Lewis turn up late you let Lewis can I do that is it just a case of letting
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your best person because he's the best he can get away with more um again I think we're all different and our aim here as an organization and all the great um leaders that we have within here is to recognize where the talent
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lies and how we can make it Thrive and that means to be adaptable we're not corporate with 100,000 people where you need fixed rules uh in order for the the organization to you know not end up in chaos um and we Embrace that fact that
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we need to create something that works for the best ones what about the balance between say it see it fix it and no blame culture it's the only sport maybe the only business that someone openly questions your Authority in front of the
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whole world the radio so when Lewis is pressing that button and saying what the heck were we doing their team and calling you out basically you you know Alex Ferguson wouldn't put up with that it's the only spot I know where
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Authority is openly questioned I think you need to have n natural Authority that's important if you're suffering from an inferiority complex you're not the right leader if you need to make it vocal on the pitch or over the radio
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that it's you who are calling the shots then you're not that person of Authority um and I've never I've never um doubted that I think in the on in the race this is a special situation there's a driver that's is on the edge
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physically and emotionally that sometimes doesn't understand um the grand scheme of things and sometimes the emotion come out because he sees things differently he get has an opinion that is probably not the right reflection of things and then it's just emotional and
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bursts out and you in that particular moment we just need to be able to take all that on board and let him vent but obviously things have a certain limit um being disrespectful against the person um we wouldn't we wouldn't tolerate that
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we we we having those discussions afterwards and say well you've overstretched it too much here and with our drivers it's great because they they acknowledge that uh sometimes they they don't like what they hear when they listen to themselves
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afterwards um because they're good people and that's why um I I don't struggle with with authority and it's it's never been an issue it's a unique sport it's an individual sport but you're in a team as well and they've
Speaker A
been in a go-kart age six trying to be the best they can be suddenly they're competing against each other was there a time you had to drag him to one side and say you're now going against the team
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yes because it's a little bit of a schizophrenic situation you you're racing in a goal cut from the age of six like you said and you alone out there uh you know imagine a six-year-old and a go the rain scary and you realize
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throughout your career that you're out there alone it's all dependent on how you perform no matter what happens left and right they're all your enemies and suddenly you come into a large structure in Formula 1 and there is someone
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telling you you have a great responsibility for the thousand people that work in the team you're carrying a a fantastic brand and you're an ambassador of that in the world and be a team player I mean that's a little bit
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like telling someone that he needs to act very differently than he did all his life and you just need to acknowledge that and we do that that um that can that is difficult so we put it out in
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the open we talk about it we talk about every race situation that can potentially pan out we talk about the conflict of interest of a driver wanting to win for himself versus the interest of the team and and I think as long as
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you're able to acknowledge these situations and find Solutions uh uh it's the best way to tackle it does it solve that problem forever no sometimes I think you just need to set the limits again and discuss it but with senior
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drivers like we have you do that once and everybody understands how would you describe your relationship with your drivers with all your team I wouldn't be able to give you a explanation I'm just trying to be authentic I'm just
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protective of them and everybody in the organization and have a Clear Vision of what we all want to achieve and if there is an individual whether in the car outside of the car that goes against those objectives then I'm just
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clear it clear communicate Max the staffen and Lewis Hamilton come to Abu Dhabi for the season finale on exactly the same points good luck made the best and the best team win exactly I'm going to take you on to 2021 and Abu Dhabi you said
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earlier stopwatch never lies and then you said almost never lies have you got over Abu Dhabi it seemed one of the most unfair things in sport watching from the sideline something is going to happen in the next 58 laps it's lights down away we go and
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Hamilton gets a decent start and he's already ahead of Max for stappen Hamilton leads into the first corner it is a dream start for Lewis Hamilton OH R TI are really struggling he's a great lpch L just keeping up we're going to
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need a miracle Nicholas latifi has crashed we get any more racing laps or not Michael yes go ahead Christian why are we getting these lap cars out of the way if we allowed the lap cars to overtake we'd
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have no laps of racing to the checker flag race controler now saying lapped cars uh to overtake the safety car to overtake it and it's ending wow M this isn't right it has left Lewis Hamilton and Max mustafin side by
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side we're going to have one lap of racing to decide the championship in 2021 V stappen down the inside it's a lead launch by ven who takes the lead of the race in 2021 Max M Dapper for the first time
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ever is champion of the world do you ever get over something like that when it could have been eight and eight no I don't think you can ever get over this but you also need to reflect on things and be able to
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compatibilize it's one of the great unfair moments in in the sports history and um not the end outcome of the championship I think both drivers were deserving Champions but it was all down to this one day equal points and that
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race was was was unfair but it's let's say something that in my professional life is not going to be forgotten and I'm trying to learn from it and be better um but on the other side emotionally it just heals when I
Speaker A
talk about it now with you it still feel it just feels unfair but it's it's it's not following me in my dreams when you say you have learned from it what would you have done differently that day I
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think there is always when it's least expected the Black Swan that's that's out there um and in none of the situations we could have envisaged what happened the race the race was one uh the regulations are very clear um and and then out of the
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blue things were decided that just didn't just didn't make any sense for anyone and uh so you learned that you it can bite you when you least expect it Christian herner said that the the visuals of you throwing down your
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headset or shouting um no Michael no he knew that he had you there you know he sort of the pressure was getting to you the pressure was getting to your team would you agree with that I I don't
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think too much about what he thinks but I'm just trying to be authentic and I'm very emotional I'm making having my heart on the sleeves I'm taking it badly when somebody tries to to harm the team sometimes the headphones break and when
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I see that I'm not proud but it's just who I am I can't hide it uh there is no thinking about it did I do that right now did I show too much emotion or not I'm just being myself trying to be
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myself how would you describe your relationship with Christian hoer he's a good team manager but it's very different personality and very different values to what we have here in the organization but he's still successful there's obviously a clash between you
Speaker A
two are different people he called you a control freak you have called him a windbag more recently you have said that you're living rentree in his head is that rivalry in any way good or can you take it too far can it become too
Speaker A
personal I'm thinking more about your team if it does become too personal it does doesn't interfere in any my decisions nor does it cause me headaches because we are different people we lead our organization in different ways uh we have different
Speaker A
responsibilities within the team I have a long-term viewer I'm a shareholder here but he's a very effective team manager and you just need to acknowledge that it doesn't interfere into any any my decisions or the way I feel we need
Speaker A
to move forward what about Mavericks I've heard you use the All Blacks quote no policy what happens about Mavericks in this team is there a room for a Maverick in your team I don't know exactly what Maverick means if it is someone that pushes the
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boundaries tries to you know bring performance out of the norm yeah I like that you can be complex you can be multifaceted you know we tolerate odd people or edgy people that's fine we want to have the best ones and as I said
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before they're complex but the fallback would always be the old blacks policy no if you lack the basic values of integrity loyality and truthfulness then you you shouldn't be here all the core values that you had generally in a winning team and a
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successful team they are easy to maintain I come up from a criting world where when the wheels are coming off that's when people start gossiping and bitching and having to go at each other from what you know was there a blame
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culture where people stick into those when in difficult times zero there was no blame culture and pointing fingers at a certain area um it was a a joint Drive in order to sort the mess but everybody in their respective field you know we
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are not a group of 5year olds that run behind the ball playing football we stay in our positions and that's something that the team has really demonstrated well the engine guys just looked after the engine and they knew the deficits
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they needed to remedy and this was the same in in in aerodynamics which obviously was a core core field where we needed to understand and everywhere else and I think that showed the strengths of the organization of holding together it
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didn't reflect yet in the results but in the long term um I think that will will bear fruits as a saying isn't it it's not what happens to you that it's important it's how you react to What happens to you how would you expect this
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team to react we were so lucky that we won eight consecutive World Championships that wasn't done in any other sports on world championship level but we knew that one day that's going to come to an end there is no sports team
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in the world that has won forever we just need to stick to the values in our organization and long-term success will come back it's like I said before my my mindset is different to many other uh people in the industry because I want to
Speaker A
create and be part of an organization that is successful long term in a sustainable way and that doesn't mean winning every Championship because that's just not possible even though we aim for it but if I look back in 20
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years that's my time span I want to see more Mercedes stars on the on the let's say on the board of constru struck the world champions than any other team what's the difference in mindset between being chased and now doing the chasing again
Speaker A
I'm going to give you a quote from Mr Herer um he's talking about you he came into this Sport with Mercedes in 2013 with the structure already in place he has never experienced anything else but winning so it's a different type of
Speaker A
pressure now um I think you need just need to adapt as a person that the environment is always going to change you one day you're the underdog um and you struggle and then you set the Benchmark and you're running around with the Target on
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your back and I think what I like in this sport is the adaptability um to the situation and almost like the darnis principle the the most um adaptive species is going to survive and not the the strongest at
Speaker A
that particular Moment In Time leadership can become a pretty lonely business I think the only thing we have in common is that we occasionally have room service alone and on our own and quite enjoy it really how do you balance
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that where you're with your team and enjoying your team but also you know just being away from the team and and and having your own thoughts and your own time yeah so we have the same issue um I think it's easier to be a loner
Speaker A
when you know you could have um you could have someone with you you know it's easier to decide I'm I want to be alone in my room when you know you could be with a group outside if if you
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haven't got any that becomes quite difficult but yes I am it's I I love to spend time um with my team and with my teammates uh and we have this fun moments they occasionally they take me out for a
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curry um uh but they say that uh they don't want to poison me uh so we have a laugh about that but we know that we on this journey together that we can trust each other but I also need my space in
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order to think about stuff I'm not at all into small talk I can't take that um and so I'm not doing it so I'm either with the team or with sus and the children in an environment where just at
Speaker A
ease and if that's not available on a race weekend then I'd much rather be on my own and have the burger and the beer and room service and decide what I do with my time the other thing you've done
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is gone off social media you don't do social media and at times you sit on plane staring at the ceiling for 10 hours why you do enjoy something like that my greatest enjoyment is thinking um I don't need any
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distraction uh from outside um we have far too little thinking time you know when I go down into the office there's many great people working away and typing away and having meetings but I really encourage to turn your chair to
Speaker A
towards the window and look out here on the campus and spend 10 minutes thinking about stuff but in this fastpac environment we not getting enough time and on an airplane you on your own you can decide what you do and in your seat
Speaker A
what I just enjoy is looking out and and and and think staring at space I I cannot understand how you would waste this time back by letting yourself be impacted by somebody else's um content and that's why also I'm I'm not on social media I I
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don't want to make myself victim of an algorithm that shows me what they want to show me but that's not always easy you know sometimes I I have this stees Instagram account and I fall into a pattern that I want to see what's
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happening out there and I need to remind myself delete the app again and then then I'm gone and then I'm gone again what about forward planning as a as a business forward planning for the next leader you know great companies Great
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teams Alex Ferguson was an example when he went Manchester United still haven't recovered how much do you have to look ahead for for damler and Mercedes as well I have no choice and eventually have a succession plan in place because
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as I am a shareholder in this team I don't want it to fail if you're trainer and you move to the next club or you retire or your team manager in Formula 1 you could say well but I don't care what
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happens after me the great ones though take a lot of effort in order to make sure that the team is successful thereafter and I think it's something that you it's a it's a leadership skill also to walk away and leave something
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that can actually uh Prosper but for me absolutely essential one day I'm going to decide that I don't want to do 23 races anymore and that somebody else can contribute better than I do um so I got to got to find someone I got to find a
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system that's that functions that can take over tasks that I do today Mercedes are constructor's champions for a record-breaking eight consecutive time I've heard you say that you're not bed about Legacy why not I don't think that anybody else cares about your
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success other than your family and yourself success is a very difficult thing to cope with and and that's why I never do anything for any other people I want to hopefully create a happy environment for the ones that are
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important to me here in the team and in my family and friends and one day we're all going to go nobody has survived um and I want to and think that it was a good journey and I enjoyed it and uh I
Speaker A
stuck to my to my values rather than having records written down on a Wikipedia page that nobody reads anyway in the end how will you judge your success is it on Race titles Constructor titles drivers championships I think
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it's so multifaceted the the biggest success is having been part of raising a family children and that that are happy uh relationship to to my wife that to make her happy um and having been part of an organization
Speaker A
that that changed people's life um having an impact on other people's life take great enjoyment for for the organization and and its members to Pro but but fundamentally you know the last thing I want to think about is is that
Speaker A
was nice thank you very much thank you [Music]
Topics:Toto WolffMercedes F1Formula 1leadershipmotorsportHungarian Grand Prixtraumaambitionmental healthteam management
